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  • WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

    After reading the thread by W123 x 2 on the perfect filter for waste oil I grabbed 4 x 20 litres, this was emptied as warm oil and had sat (maybe) for 2 days.

    Strained out the bigger bits using a sieve leaving about 2 litres in the bottom of drum (now settling further to get a bit more oil).

    Initially I tried the T shirt trick, double cotton sock trick and track suit trick (all very messy and better not thought about)

    The woollies bags worked really well, I filtered at night when cooler adn using only 2 bags the lot filtered over 4 nights.

    I found that the bags quickly lined with fats (it was quite fatty) and went from a "flow" to a "drip" - hence the time scale.

    In the meantime I ordered a couple of 5 micron bags.

    Visually the woollies screenings looked very good, very clear, poured it into the 5 micron bags and really surprised at the flow and vicosity of the oil.

    I am wondering if the slow filter through the woollies bag and the additional layer of fats (making the drips) improved the quality?

    I am just waiting for the first 20 litres to 5 micron filter.

    Intend to mix with 50:50 VP bio and oil and see what happens.

    Running a toyota 1hz using a single CAV filter - finally got it on the vehicle, had a lot of problems with sealing - another story.

    Any advice before I pour it in?

    Another one - the CAV filter has been setup using the manufacturers direction flow, this appears to me to put the fuel onto the top of the filter and then down into the bowl, up the centre stem to the motor.

    I would have thought the logical flow would have been down the stem into the bowl (rubbish settles into the bowl) and fuel then up through filter into the motor (the OEM filter works this way)

    Any suggestions here? just reverse flow it?

    Geoff
    ****************
    Telegraph Point NSW
    Landcruiser GXL '96 - 80:20 blends
    Pug 1.6 HDi - 308 Touring Wagon - definitely not game :-)
    ****************

  • #2
    Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

    Geoff,
    The layer of high melting point oil does indeed improve the filtration performance (in terms of removing much smaller particles than withour the layer) I cannot provide any specs for this improvement, but I don't know of any particles which would percolate thru the high melting point oils then thru the filter medium.

    Your description of the flow for the CAV Filters is correct. I have not identified any satisfactory explanation of the reasons for this flow direction.
    The filter contaminant catchment area is greater for the outside-> in flow direction.
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    '06 Musso Sports 4X4 Manual Crew Cab tray back.
    '04 Rexton 4X4 Automatic SUV
    '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP) - Wife's car

    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Engine donor for W123 coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab well body. [Head gasket blew!]
    '04 Rexton SUV 2.9L Turbodiesel same as Musso - Our Family car.
    '06 Musso sports Crew Cab Trayback - My hack (no air cond, no heater).

    Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
    Adding images and/or documents to your posts

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

      Geoff, I just went outside to check my CAV and you are right, the fuel goes in the top, down the centre of the filter itself and then goes back up through the filter medium / paper and out the top.

      I am not sure of the housing / adapter you have but this is how mine is setup and in my opinion is the right way to do it. That way heavy things and water stay in the glass bowl before going into the filter, not the other way round. Water being puched through the filteer makes no sense.

      With regards sealing, you had the seals around the right way didn't you? I fixed a mates who had his professionally installed, they did that too, he could not work out why he got air into it all the time.

      Make sure that oil is warm/ hot before it goes into the 1Hz / injection pump, reduce its viscosity will be the secret.

      Matt
      Matt
      Senior Member
      Last edited by Matt; 22 April 2007, 09:43 PM. Reason: added a few things
      Biodiesel Bandit

      Landcruiser '98 80 series B100.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

        Originally posted by Tony From West Oz View Post
        Geoff,

        Your description of the flow for the CAV Filters is correct. I have not identified any satisfactory explanation of the reasons for this flow direction.
        The filter contaminant catchment area is greater for the outside-> in flow direction.
        Thanks,

        are you saying that my first or second description is correct? I personally feel that the way the direction arrows indicate is wrong - have asked for some info from filter people.

        Asked a diesel mechanic, without any prompting, which way the flow should be and no problems, down the centre into the bowl, back thru the filter.

        Geoff
        ****************
        Telegraph Point NSW
        Landcruiser GXL '96 - 80:20 blends
        Pug 1.6 HDi - 308 Touring Wagon - definitely not game :-)
        ****************

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

          Originally posted by Geoffwin View Post
          Thanks,

          are you saying that my first or second description is correct? I personally feel that the way the direction arrows indicate is wrong - have asked for some info from filter people.

          Asked a diesel mechanic, without any prompting, which way the flow should be and no problems, down the centre into the bowl, back thru the filter.

          Geoff
          Geoff, The flow indications cast into the filter head produce the outside > in flow, which does appear to negate the availability of the sediment bowl. It may be that the CAV filters are not water blocking filters and thus, any water which pass thru the filter cartridge should fall to the sediment bowl and not to the IP.
          I agree that it would seem to be better to have the sediment bowl before the filter, to allow sediment, water, etc, to settle in the bowl rather than being trapped by the element. Thus you should reverse the connections, after replacing the filter element, to make the filter work in the direction you prefer.

          Regards,
          Tony
          Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

          Current Vehicles in stable:
          '06 Musso Sports 4X4 Manual Crew Cab tray back.
          '04 Rexton 4X4 Automatic SUV
          '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP) - Wife's car

          Previous Vehicles:
          '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup.
          '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
          '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Engine donor for W123 coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
          '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel
          '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
          '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
          '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab well body. [Head gasket blew!]
          '04 Rexton SUV 2.9L Turbodiesel same as Musso - Our Family car.
          '06 Musso sports Crew Cab Trayback - My hack (no air cond, no heater).

          Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
          Adding images and/or documents to your posts

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

            Thanks for the clarification Tony, perhaps I was the only one who needed it?

            Fair point on the ability of the filter and this may well be the reasoning. There are also similar units that are used before the filter to specifically remove water and heavy rubbish - perhaps I will look into one of these as well, should not affect the flow as they are basically a settling tank.

            I reversed the connectors last night, basically could not get the toyota to run due to lack of fuel.

            I understand that the delphi 296 have a rating of 7 microns and the OEM is 15 microns (?) so this would not help.

            Geoff
            ****************
            Telegraph Point NSW
            Landcruiser GXL '96 - 80:20 blends
            Pug 1.6 HDi - 308 Touring Wagon - definitely not game :-)
            ****************

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

              Geoff, use the pump on the CAV head unit if it has one, otherwise some heavy cranking over may make it suck it up.

              As for the filtering, the CAV is 5 micron, OEM is 7 micron, Cost is approx $4 and $47 respectively but you may already know this.

              Matt
              Biodiesel Bandit

              Landcruiser '98 80 series B100.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

                Thanks for the responses,

                micron rating on the filters - only going on what the diesel supplies told me - but neither here nor there so long as the rating is finer then the OEM.

                Tried first sample today, very cautious, 1 litre oil in 4 litres of VP bio, didn't miss a beat, will probably try a 50:50 next on a 5 litre sample. Checking the fuel bowl showed a definite colour change in the fuel - the filtered veg oil is definitely darker then the VP bio.

                As for the filter, intend to leave as supplied for the first filter and will then try reverse flow again and use hand pump to force flow.

                That DVD is in the mail Matt, I had some problems using win2K, I have been assured that it will run fine on XP, if it works give me some feedback on how good (or otherwise) it is.

                Geoff
                ****************
                Telegraph Point NSW
                Landcruiser GXL '96 - 80:20 blends
                Pug 1.6 HDi - 308 Touring Wagon - definitely not game :-)
                ****************

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

                  Something I learnt from Bruce ...

                  When changing the CAV element or when the CAV is newly fitted. I take off the top bolt and fit a 1/2'' hose off cut on top of the bolt's openning and suck carefully untill I get the cav filled "does not take a minute". I often hear the oil comming through the hose this when I stop otherwise I get oil in my mouth . The rest easy since I can prime the system with the prime pump on the engine.

                  Cheers
                  Fitian
                  <><

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

                    Originally posted by Geoffwin
                    As for the filter, intend to leave as supplied for the first filter and will then try reverse flow again and use hand pump to force flow.
                    Geoff,
                    DO NOT reverse the flow thru a used element, much of the filtrate in the element will be released and flow into the 'clean' area of hrte fuel system with potentially catastrophic effects on your injection pump / injectors.

                    If this was not what you meant in your post above, please accept my apologies.

                    Regards,
                    Tony
                    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

                    Current Vehicles in stable:
                    '06 Musso Sports 4X4 Manual Crew Cab tray back.
                    '04 Rexton 4X4 Automatic SUV
                    '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP) - Wife's car

                    Previous Vehicles:
                    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup.
                    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
                    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Engine donor for W123 coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
                    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel
                    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
                    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
                    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab well body. [Head gasket blew!]
                    '04 Rexton SUV 2.9L Turbodiesel same as Musso - Our Family car.
                    '06 Musso sports Crew Cab Trayback - My hack (no air cond, no heater).

                    Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
                    Adding images and/or documents to your posts

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

                      thanks for the warning Tony,

                      intention was to change the flow when I next change the filter - but then I have done some really silly things in my time so it was timely:-)

                      Starting to feel ahppier about it working, now I just need to streamline the process to minimise wvo handling - much worse then diesel!

                      I am thyinking of cascading filters? anyone any experience on a way to set this up withouthaving to climb a ladder to start the process?

                      Geoff
                      ****************
                      Telegraph Point NSW
                      Landcruiser GXL '96 - 80:20 blends
                      Pug 1.6 HDi - 308 Touring Wagon - definitely not game :-)
                      ****************

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

                        Originally posted by Geoffwin View Post
                        After reading the thread by W123 x 2 on the perfect filter for waste oil I grabbed 4 x 20 litres
                        I'm new around here. Would someone please post what w123x2 perfect filter is.

                        Last summer I was using material I got from a local Felt manufacturer. I can choose the best material for the job. It was slow going but it got the fat and then slowed quickly. It's better than it needs to be.

                        While shopping around I've located lots of mateial I could use for filtering. If I knew what 123 was using I could compare to what I have available and then I could size something up.

                        After I get the information on the perfect filter I'll tell you all the easiest way on how to get the job done.

                        You start by cutting the bottom out of a 5 gal. plastic pail. Then cut a solid disc 4 or 5 in. in diameter larger than the pail. Now cut a round opening in the disc slightly larger than the bottom of the pail. Cut a round piece of the material you will be using as a filter the same diameter as your disc. The material has to be at least 1/16 in thick. Lay the filter material over the opening.

                        Emergency

                        I have to run. I'll finish the post tomorrow. Sorry......

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

                          Geoff you are a brave man! This is on your 307 HDi I gather?

                          I have heard of a lift pump being available that goes in the fuel tank, this may be of beneifit.

                          Thank you very much for the DVD, it will make my week! I am determined to intercool mine and this will be a great help quite apart from the routine servicing.

                          Good luck with the CAV, its a good filter and as I found out a lot cheaper that the OEM genuine part! approx $40

                          Matt


                          Originally posted by Geoffwin View Post
                          Thanks for the responses,

                          micron rating on the filters - only going on what the diesel supplies told me - but neither here nor there so long as the rating is finer then the OEM.

                          Tried first sample today, very cautious, 1 litre oil in 4 litres of VP bio, didn't miss a beat, will probably try a 50:50 next on a 5 litre sample. Checking the fuel bowl showed a definite colour change in the fuel - the filtered veg oil is definitely darker then the VP bio.

                          As for the filter, intend to leave as supplied for the first filter and will then try reverse flow again and use hand pump to force flow.

                          That DVD is in the mail Matt, I had some problems using win2K, I have been assured that it will run fine on XP, if it works give me some feedback on how good (or otherwise) it is.

                          Geoff
                          Biodiesel Bandit

                          Landcruiser '98 80 series B100.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

                            No way on the 307 - boss would kill me!

                            Working on a 1996 toyota 1HZ with dual tanks.

                            Probably happy with good bio in the 307 but only supply I have here is VP so far and it appears to me that there is a significant variation week to week.

                            I asked yesterday what blend they had? ans - no idea!
                            What do you normally get? ans - whatever they send.

                            Hope the DVD works properly, I have had issues with win2K, the seller is trying to work it out. He said that there were no problems with XP

                            Geoff
                            ****************
                            Telegraph Point NSW
                            Landcruiser GXL '96 - 80:20 blends
                            Pug 1.6 HDi - 308 Touring Wagon - definitely not game :-)
                            ****************

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: WVO and filters - woollies supplied!

                              Originally posted by wonpapachongtongs View Post
                              I'm new around here. Would someone please post what w123x2 perfect filter is.
                              Hi wonpapa etal

                              the perfect "filter" is discussed here

                              http://www.biofuelsforum.com/svo_use...ilter_wvo.html

                              You would have similar in Toronto

                              good luck

                              Geoff
                              ****************
                              Telegraph Point NSW
                              Landcruiser GXL '96 - 80:20 blends
                              Pug 1.6 HDi - 308 Touring Wagon - definitely not game :-)
                              ****************

                              Comment

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