PDA

View Full Version : Does this anger anyone?



joe
3rd March 2008, 08:53 PM
Israel pulls out of Gaza leaving 110 dead - Times Online (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article3473788.ece)

Fitian
4th March 2008, 01:02 AM
This angers me but does not surprise me.

Are not they the sons and daughters of Jesus killers? If they dare to kill the son of the living God will they fear killing a 110?

May the Lord have mercy

Robert
4th March 2008, 06:07 PM
Angers me too, has for many years. Religious reasons aside, I can't see why such a large slab of the US "foreign aid" budget goes to buying helicopters and other arms for the Israeli forces to go and kill their neighbours. Yes, I know the situation is a lot more complex than that, but it is still not right.

Fitian
4th March 2008, 09:28 PM
I can't see why such a large slab of the US "foreign aid" budget goes to buying helicopters and other arms for the Israeli forces to go and kill their neighbours. .

It is simple Rob. Selling helicopters and other arms for Israelis means more money to USA. the more they give Israel the more they sell to other neighbour countries.

Sad isn't it?

gwalker
5th March 2008, 08:51 AM
I cannot imagine any other country allowing its population to be continually rocketed or suicide-bombed for years without a response.

Fitian
5th March 2008, 10:47 AM
History tells us that Israel attacked/invaded other countries. Egypt is one of them. Creating hate towards them from all the arab/islamic countries.

I guess this is why USA is much disliked now because Israel has been USA's little baby for many years.

Captain Echidna
5th March 2008, 05:31 PM
My thoughts are, if war is the answer, then the question is flawed....

I also think there is the problem in the schoolyard where one kiddy is upset by another kiddy, and convinces other kiddies to help in his conflict. Country/ group conflicts are not dissimilar.

Killing people is wrong. It doesnt matter if the other person killed a member of your family, if you kill him, then he has a reason to kill you or another member of your family, so it continues. The same sentence with family / group/ country still holds

eventually it needs to stop. Someone needs to say I wont continue it. Working out who is to blame is futile while 2 parties are behaving incorrectly. Same a schoolyard, same as any other 2 groups.

A simplistic argument but has some points.

TroyH
5th March 2008, 05:49 PM
History tells us that Israel attacked/invaded other countries. Egypt is one of them. Creating hate towards them from all the arab/islamic countries.

I guess this is why USA is much disliked now because Israel has been USA's little baby for many years.
History tells us the problems have been there for the better part of 1000 years (or more) and they are nowhere near as one sided as you suggest.

Sadly society always seems to remember the hatred, but never the cause. So they just keep fighting because it's the way it has always been.

Captain Echidna
5th March 2008, 07:31 PM
Sadly society always seems to remember the hatred, but never the cause. So they just keep fighting because it's the way it has always been.

Could you imagine a relationships counselor at the peace table? "ok you are justified in retailating for the deaths of those close to you..... But is it working for you?, are you getting the outcomes you want, or is it causing more retailation?"

pangit
6th March 2008, 08:09 AM
I also think there is the problem in the schoolyard where one kiddy is upset by another kiddy, and convinces other kiddies to help in his conflict. Country/ group conflicts are not dissimilar.

I think your comparison is pretty apt. I was particularly struck when I saw the Israeli PM on TV a couple of days ago saying something like, "Well they started it. If they stopped killing us then we would stop killing them". It sounded so childish just like my kids' playground banter. The only difference is that they play their games with deadly weapons.

gwalker
6th March 2008, 08:21 AM
History tells us that Israel attacked/invaded other countries. Egypt is one of them. Creating hate towards them from all the arab/islamic countries.

I guess this is why USA is much disliked now because Israel has been USA's little baby for many years.

History
1947/48: Israel became a Nation recognised by UN

1948: Arab military forces began their invasion of Israel on May 15 with 8,000 to 10,000 Egyptians, 2,000 to 4,000 Iraqis, 4,000 to 5,000 Transjordanians, 3,000 to 4,000 Syrians, 1,000 to 2,000 Lebanese, and smaller numbers of Saudi Arabian and Yemeni troops, about 25,000 in all.

1956: Sinai War - Following attacks on Israeli settlements originating from Egyptian-held territory and Nasser's new agreement to buy arms from the Soviet Union, Israel initially launched raids against the Egyptians and followed it up with a pre-emptive strike while Britain and France moved ito secure the Suez Canal.

1967: Six Day War -On 13 May Egypt reinforced its forces in the Sinai border and Israel mobilized in response.

1973: Yom Kippur War - On 6 October Egyptian and Syrian forces launched a surprise attack on Israel.

1987: The Intifada - Between 1987 and 1993, Palestinian civilians protested Israeli occupation in an ongoing campaign of loosely organized confrontations in which Palestinian youths burned automobiles and pelted Israeli Defense Force (IDF) troops with rocks.

2000: The Al-Aqsa Intifada began in September 2000

2006: Lebanon - On 12 July eight IDF soldiers were killed and two kidnapped, following an attack by Hizbullah on the border with Lebanon. Hizbullah simultaneously launched Katyusha attacks against Israel.

yorta2
6th March 2008, 09:17 AM
A very selective history, that one...

gwalker
6th March 2008, 09:34 AM
I doubt that there will ever be peace in the middle east while Israel exists as a nation and all its neighbours are committed to its annihilation.

The only hope for 'peace' is when Israel no longer exists.

..on the other hand, if 'Peak Oil' is a bigger problem than 'Global Warming' and as imminent as another thread suggest, then people will cease caring what happens on top of the Arabian sands in a few years from now.

dagwill
8th March 2008, 11:06 AM
well said mr walker peace is when israel no longer exists

Israel was created to give Jews a homeland,which they did not have.

So how do you think all the resident people felt when they were displaced and forced to give up what was theirs and give it to people that flooded in from all over the world,who really had nothing to do with the place.{except some religous claim} but then palistinians had that too!! and were still pushed out
From memory one of the main reasons the US gives so much aid to israel, is that prophesses say that israel must exist in the final days,and all the prophesses can be fulfilled so that we can all go to fairy heaven land. I.E. no Israel......no heaven
We are intelligent reasonable people. WHY cant we elect governments that simply ban war, world wide,i often wish we could.
Or is that a simplistic childish thought as silly as going to heaven , , , , ,and just not going to happen,
as long as we put up with greedy people making money out of war

TroyH
9th March 2008, 07:17 PM
The land that is now Israel has changed hands between the Jews, the Christians and the Muslims many, many times in the last thousand years.

Why do you think Israel is where it is?

Do the children who are born there, have any less right to be there than the previous inhabitants?




We are intelligent reasonable people. WHY cant we elect governments that simply ban war, world wide,i often wish we could.
Or is that a simplistic childish thought as silly as going to heaven , , , , ,and just not going to happen,
as long as we put up with greedy people making money out of war
How would you enforce it? A severe "telling off"?

Nuddy
12th March 2008, 05:21 PM
A very selective history, that one...
Yes selective but accurate.
I remember the 6 day war and the events leading up to it.
60 years back the US kicked the palestinians out of their homeland and created the nation of Israel. This was almost certainly a mistake and should not have happened but it is just like any other invasion except that the invaders are not the occupiers and the previous residents are usually allowed to stay (suppressed). Invasions take place throughout history, many more have taken place in the last 60 years. The big problem was that the palestinians were not assimilated into the surrounding lands. They are still in refugee camps! Another mistake by the US. None of this is the Israeli's fault. They were placed there, they didn't do the invading.
"History
1947/48: Israel became a Nation recognised by UN

1948: Arab military forces began their invasion of Israel on May 15 with 8,000 to 10,000 Egyptians, 2,000 to 4,000 Iraqis, 4,000 to 5,000 Transjordanians, 3,000 to 4,000 Syrians, 1,000 to 2,000 Lebanese, and smaller numbers of Saudi Arabian and Yemeni troops, about 25,000 in all."

The choice for the Israelis was to cop it and be slaughtered or to fight back.
They chose to fight back - wouldn't you?

In 1948 it may have been possible for the US to undo their mistake - take a piece of land in the US mainland and give it to the israelis. Give palestine back to the palestinians. After a few years it is too late to undo.

60 years down the track I don't know what the answer is but I don't blame the israelis for wanting to stay alive. If someone wanted to take my home and slaughter my family I would do whatever I could to make that difficult, to stop it happening.
To return to the schoolyard analogy, we have the teachers pet being given unfair privelege and the rest of the school beating up on the teachers pet. The teachers pet did nothing wrong what should he do, just cop the beating?

The Israelis could just stop fighting. What would happen then?

pangit
13th March 2008, 01:26 PM
Well it all comes down to religion, which is a complete scam anyway, and the cause of more suffering in the world than anything else. There is no God, just us and the planet we live on. When we die that's it. No reincarnation, no heaven, no 49 virgins for martyrs or eternal damnation for sinners.

So we should all just try to live our lives and get on with each other as best we can for the short time available to us on this planet.

So there. Stick that in yer pipe and smoke it!

Nuddy
13th March 2008, 06:43 PM
Well it all comes down to religion, which is a complete scam anyway, and the cause of more suffering in the world than anything else. There is no God, just us and the planet we live on. When we die that's it. No reincarnation, no heaven, no 49 virgins for martyrs or eternal damnation for sinners.

So we should all just try to live our lives and get on with each other as best we can for the short time available to us on this planet.

So there. Stick that in yer pipe and smoke it!
I disagree. I don't think it all comes down to religion. I think it is all about race. There are very many atheistic and agnostic jews and they are persecuted for their race. The palestinians are not attacking the israelis because of their jewish religion, they are attacking because they want their homeland back. The israelis are not resisting because the attackers are muslim and/or christian, they are resisting to defend their home and families. Perhaps religion does come into it a little with the muslims but I don't think it does at all with the christians, jews, atheists and agnostics.
If the state of israel had been set up on the US mainland there would have been no problem. It is all the fault of those who kicked the palestinians out of their home, and that wasn't the israelis.

dagwill
18th March 2008, 01:07 PM
i agree with pangit
religion has caused more suffering than anything else ever has.
i dont profess to know "the answer"
but i do know it is best to live in peace and harmony, high morrals are an inbuilt genetic thing. If you live by a code of ethics you tend to be happier, have less conflict and live longer
you sure dont need religion and fairy tales to justify morals

We have an obligation to enjoy the wonderfull world we have...........and to make biofuel.....

Terry Syd
18th March 2008, 04:24 PM
A lot of opinions in this thread, but there would be a lot more informed opinions if some research was done. Here is probably the best source up to about the mid-1950's.

Controversy of Zion (http://knud.eriksen.adr.dk/Controversybook/)

It is a long read, but that's because it is well researched.

The book only goes up to about 1957. It doesn't cover all the later disclosures about the scam known as the 'Holocaust'. For that, I would suggest you read the trial transcripts of the Zundel trial.

After that, you may want to read 'The Interrogation of Rakovsky -

savethemales.ca - Rothschilds Conduct "Red Symphony" (http://www.savethemales.ca/000275.html)

CHEVY
19th March 2008, 12:05 AM
arr, bollocks... I thought I was over in rollitup.org for a minute.

IMHO, I think the best way to solve this Ayerab israel thingy is the mid-east dingbats should pay to relocate the entire Isrealy people to Australia. Australia will gain an inteligent and industrious people and the dingbats can be left to squable over what ever it is they squable over - endlessly.

gwalker
19th March 2008, 08:29 AM
...It doesn't cover all the later disclosures about the scam known as the 'Holocaust'. For that, I would suggest you read the trial transcripts of the Zundel trial.

more information?

pangit
19th March 2008, 09:49 AM
IMHO, I think the best way to solve this Ayerab israel thingy is the mid-east dingbats should pay to relocate the entire Isrealy people to Australia. Australia will gain an inteligent and industrious people and the dingbats can be left to squable over what ever it is they squable over - endlessly.

He he. Yes I've read somewhere that Israel produces more stuff (technology, services, manufactured products etc) than the rest of the Middle East put together (or something like that). They have no oil or other resources and yet are way more productive than any other country in the region.

I've dealt with several Israel based tech companies through work, and always find them to be excellent to deal with and have first class products.

Terry Syd
19th March 2008, 10:05 AM
The Zundel trials in the late 1980's were the first time that the evidence about the 'Holocaust' was actually subjected to scrutiny. The trials were brought because of Zundel's book 'Did 6 Million really die'. The second trial is where the meat of the information lies.

The prosecution brought in various 'surviors' to give evidence, some of them very well known in the Holocaust Industry. In every case they flat out got ripped to shreads in cross-examination. The defence team had done their homework and showed that each and everyone of them was a fraud.

That was the prosecution case - but it gets worse. Then the defence opened. They brought in real survivors from Auschwitz that were Jewish that gave their evidence that there were no gas chambers. It was a work camp that had a Olympic swimming pool, soccer field, theater, movie house, library (with a brothel above it), dentistry, hospital (including a nursary where over 3,000 live births were recorded). It got so bad that the prosecutor stopped cross-examining. I am a former Barrister, when the evidence against you is so damaging, the last thing you do is keep digging the hole deeper. That was what was happening with the prosecution. The more they cross-examined the worse it got.

There was a lot of objective evidence that was also tendered. The Leutcher Report on the alleged 'gas chamber' is completely compelling. The 'chamber' was the former morgue that had been re-modeled into a 'gas chamber' for propaganda purposes. All of the objective evidence was subject to cross-examination and held up, in fact, just like with the witnesses it made the evidence even stronger.

After the trial the Russians realised the cat was out of the bag, so in 1989 they released the captured records from Auschwitz. The rail records from the camp correlated to the separate bureacracy of the German rail system.

You can now not only find out how many Jews, Gypsys, Poles died at Auschwitz, but you can find out their names, numbers, where they came from, familly records, etc. You can also find out what they died from.

Over 56,000 Jews died from the typhus epidemics. Over 2,600 died from other various dieses, industrial deaths, old age, etc. The total number of Jews that were executed at Auschwitz is 117, primarily for camp infractions.

The 6 million figure comes from the Jewish Talmud. The first time the Zionists tried to run it up the flag pole was after WWI. Do some research and you will find a copy of the front page of the NT Times after WWI where they proclaim the 6 million figure. After WWII the allies did not want a war crimes tribunal, however the World Jewish Congress demanded it. The Nurenburg Trials were a show trial put on by the Zionists. When you go through how it was put together and who conducted it, how the evidence was chosen, tortured confessions, etc. you will be amazed that it was allowed by the Allies. Go through Churchill's and Eisenhower's memoirs and you will not find a single reference to the 'death camps'. Go through the Red Cross records of the visits to the Auschwitz and you will find no reference to gas chambers or mass executions.

You need to read 'The Controversy of Zion' to begin to make sense of all this. We truely live in The Matrix.

Unfortunately, most people cannot be bothered doing extensive research and simply want the 15 second sound bite to tell them what to think. If you haven't got the time to read Douglas Reed's lengthy volume, then here is a quick speech by Benjamin Freedman that gives a fairly good overview. The Amazing Warnings Of Benjamin Freedman (http://www.rense.com/general34/amaz.htm)

He mentions Khazars (as does Reed). Most people are ignorant of the fact that the Ashkenazi Jews are not semetic. The Khazar kingdom took the Jewish religion around 850AD. They had no written language, so they used the Hebrew alphabet to write their own language, that is what Yiddish is, the remnants of the old Khazar language interwoven with German grammar and words as the language moved westward. The Ashkenazi Jews are extremely prejudiced against the Sephardic Jews (real Jews). Here is one example of how that prejudice is exercised - Re: 100,000 Radiations - The Massacre of The Biblical Jews by The AshkeNAZIS (http://soc.mailarchive.ca/culture.usa/2007-07/8814.html)

TroyH
19th March 2008, 12:10 PM
Now, where did I put my tinfoil hat...

dagwill
19th March 2008, 03:04 PM
thanks Terry for what i believe is very good and believable reading
[i am very scceptical at the vast amount of propaganda that we are fed in the main stream and expected to believe without question]

Terry Syd
19th March 2008, 05:37 PM
Thanks Dagwill, I had to do it the hard way. Read a book here, read another bit there. Sift through disinformation by the tonne. When I read Reed's book it confirmed all the other sources I had gone through. It is a long difficult job to read through all of it, but it will lay a considerable foundation for other things you will run into. Bush is not the first puppet of the Neocon/Zionists for sure, in fact, I consider President Wilson an even bigger fool. It will also give you some insight into why Mel Gibson blurted out while he was drunk "the Jews are behind all the wars". He overstated the position, but Reed will fill you in with a lot of the details.

Like so many people I was raised within the Matrix. I had to read 'The Diary of Anne Frank' while in High School. It is all part of the indoctrination. It turns out that even that book is a hoax. Anne's father, Otto, was sued by one of the ghost writers for the book and won, Otto had to pay up.

A lot of people cannot conceive of the duplicity that exists. Mind control is an insidious thing, once the brain has been wired a certain way it is very difficult to retrain it. If I asked you "what is one and one?" - you would quickly respond "two". You don't have to think about it, you don't have to count on your fingers, the answer is wired in. It used to be that if you asked "what shape is the Earth?" - people would respond "flat". That's because they were wired to respond that way, that was their beliefs, even though they were false. If you were to say "there were no homicidial gas chambers at Auschwitz" - people will automatically respond with "you're anti-semetic". Its wired in, they don't think about it, they never question the beliefs they were programmed to believe.

Good luck on your rewiring job.

TroyH
19th March 2008, 10:16 PM
Apart from the hearsay from other people, do you have any hard proof that makes you believe one version of the story over another?

Have you ever been to Germany and looked at anything there?

Terry Syd
20th March 2008, 05:09 AM
I lived for 2 1/2 years in Germany. Auschwitz is in Poland. I visited Dacau. I'm familiar with the BS about Dacau. There is one segment of the Dacau Trials that is hilarious. A fellow is giving evidence about how one of the Nazi defendents killed his brother at Dacau. The defendent stood up and pointed out to the Tribunal that the witnesse's brother was actually sitting in the back of the Court. The Tribunal judge turned to the witness and said "How can we hang these people if you are so stupid as to bring your brother to the trial?" - It's actually recorded in the transcripts.

Some people can take the 'red' pill and others will always be 'blue' pill people, hopefully this is just a stage of disbelief that you will work your way through. If you begin to do small bits of research (I have provided a few links), then you can deal with the cognitive dissonance a bit at a time.

There are many layers to this onion of reality. As you peel off one layer, you will find another. My only suggestion is to keep peeling - good luck.

dagwill
20th March 2008, 12:18 PM
thanks again terry for wadeing through masses of info and shareing whats relevant
forgive me getting off topic but have a read of this.[click on undelined link below]
Iknew something was wrong,the night of 9/11 and not a single fighter was scrambled. Everything was in place for the Sydney olympics for that exact senerio,it was all well rehersed and no surprise.

Michael Meacher: This war on terrorism is bogus | Politics | The Guardian (http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2003/sep/06/september11.iraq)

as i said sorry to get off topic but i feel this substansiates your statements about our brains being wired to whatever crap we are fed,and if you question that "crap" your a heretic or worse

Captain Echidna
20th March 2008, 01:29 PM
I wonder if the people in this forum have recieved an "antidote" for the mass media rubbish?

According to the media there is no real alternative for fossil fuel. I think inthe 50s it was going to be the nuclear car, then in the 70s it was going to be the electric car, in the 90s it was going to be the fuel cell, but in the meantime, we need to use fossil fuel and there is nothing we can do.

Of course at some point in time most of us have flicked the switched labeled veggie oil, or poured in the biodiesel, and said to ourselves, well that wasnt that hard was it? realised the "its hard to come up with an alternate to fossil fuel" story was crap, and wondered how much of the rest of the media is crap as well.

The funny thing about the matrix is the book its based on is not set in the future, but the current day.

Terry Syd
20th March 2008, 02:03 PM
Dagwill, at the risk of keeping us off topic. I picked the 9-11 psy-op on the day, I'd been through three of them before and it had the same 'feel' about it. Six days later I was in Hawaii and saw what was going on, I told my relatives, "I don't know what is going on, but this is a psy-op, don't get caught up in it, in about six months information will begin to leak out." It took a little longer than that, but there is enough information available now that it can no longer be denied by anybody open minded enough to evaluate the evidence.

False flag operations are very common in controlling the masses. We had our own 9-11 style psy-op with the Port Arthur Massacre. I've written four articles on just some of the evidence that is available (Bryant didn't do it), also another article on the machinations in Canberra. If you are interested in reading them, send me a private email and I'll send you the attachments.

Going back on topic, the Middle East/Israel conflict cannot be understood until you go back through the mind set of the Zionists and what events have occurred in the past. This is not some recent event in our history, it has it's origins in the Levites, Phareses, Talmudic priests and now the Zionists. That is where Reed's work 'The Controversy of Zion' helps you to put it all together.

After you have got your head around 'The Controversy', I'll give you another layer of the "onion".

Marc1
20th March 2008, 04:14 PM
I think your comparison is pretty apt. I was particularly struck when I saw the Israeli PM on TV a couple of days ago saying something like, "Well they started it. If they stopped killing us then we would stop killing them". It sounded so childish just like my kids' playground banter. The only difference is that they play their games with deadly weapons.

The Israel Arab conflict can not be summarized condemned or supported with simple statements like the above.
Probably the most difficult thing to decide is how far back in history are you willing to go in order to draw your conclusions as to who has the right to be there, that is...who invaded who. Furthermore who do you recognize as authority to own the land.

You think that the reasoning "they started" is childish, yet you have not taken into consideration a significant cultural factor. Both the Arabic speaking Muslims and the Israelis have a culture were lying and deceiving is not as we understand it but is part of a perfectly acceptable strategy. Furthermore, for a person in that culture, showing restrain, compassion or generosity is simply an act of weakness to be taken advantage of.

There is a lot more to this conflict than westerners can understand from the biased and unilateral information dished out by media particularly in Australia were news are heavily edited in favor of the (poor victim) Palestinians, and against the (rich bad) Israelis.

So back to my first mention of history. How far are you willing to go back to?
I would suggest a read through the history of this region.
Wikipedia gives a balanced account of facts. By the way the region was called Palestina by the Byzantines in 330 or so accounting for much more than the current Israel and Palestine, making therefore all inhabitants "Palestinians", a bit like "Americans" does not necessarily mean born in the USA

The root of the modern day conflict between muslims and jews may seem as a territorial dispute but is much more than that.
A big mistake was of course to split the non-Jewish land in two sectors. Notice I avoid calling that land Palestina since that name is the name of a region. There was never a culture or a nation that could be called Palestina, and the modern day Palestinian are emigrants from different Arab nations who came to the region to work in Israel, hardly a type who could claim "aboriginality" to the place.

Many times I thought the solution to the conflict to be simple. Swap the Gaza strip with an equivalent amount of land from the Israely state adjacent to the west bank and problem solved, no need to pass through Israel anymore so no more killings.

Only a non Israeli or non Arab can think of such solution.
Plus the fact remains that Israel needs laborers so needs Arabs to work for them. Reminds me of the so called illegal Mexican in the US who can enter any bank and ask to open a bank account "for illegals".

I think that for us sitting away from the conflict it is too easy to think up solutions or to lay blame to either side.




History of Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Palestine)

Marc1
20th March 2008, 04:57 PM
Terry said... Bryan did not do it.

NEXUS: MartinBryant1 (http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles/MartinBryant1.html)
NEXUS: MartinBryant2 (http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles/MartinBryant2.html)
NEXUS: MartinBryant3 (http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles/MartinBryant3.html)

About the Author:
Carl Wernerhoff is the pseudonym for a Sydney-based conspiracy researcher with a particular interest in the history of political assassinations and orchestrated tragedies such as the Port Arthur and Columbine massacres. He has a PhD in History and currently works as a teacher. His recently released e-book, What's Going On? A Critical Study of the Port Arthur Massacre, can be downloaded (free of charge) from Ourmedia: socdemnow (http://www.ourmedia.org/user/95839).
Carl Wernerhoff can be contacted by writing to him care of NEXUS, or by email at cwernerhoff@yahoo.com.

TroyH
20th March 2008, 07:07 PM
I lived for 2 1/2 years in Germany. Auschwitz is in Poland. I visited Dacau. I'm familiar with the BS about Dacau. There is one segment of the Dacau Trials that is hilarious. A fellow is giving evidence about how one of the Nazi defendents killed his brother at Dacau. The defendent stood up and pointed out to the Tribunal that the witnesse's brother was actually sitting in the back of the Court. The Tribunal judge turned to the witness and said "How can we hang these people if you are so stupid as to bring your brother to the trial?" - It's actually recorded in the transcripts.

Some people can take the 'red' pill and others will always be 'blue' pill people, hopefully this is just a stage of disbelief that you will work your way through. If you begin to do small bits of research (I have provided a few links), then you can deal with the cognitive dissonance a bit at a time.

There are many layers to this onion of reality. As you peel off one layer, you will find another. My only suggestion is to keep peeling - good luck.

I read quite a bit of that first book you referenced (about the real "Israelites". It was quite interesting (and seems well put together, although the preface nearly put me off...). I'll definately look at things a little differently now. It's an area that interests me, so I'm going to take it with a pinch of salt and look into things a little more.

In regards to the later stuff about the Holocaust, well I'm not as convinced. I know people who escaped from Hungary during the war, and have been to some of the more historically relevant parts of Germany (like Nürnberg - although I didn't get a chance to see the death camps or Nazi Trials Court) and remain skeptical that the entire planet (including the people who experienced it first hand) would be so in the dark about what happened. But I will keep it in mind and consider it next time I'm there.

As a matter of interest, I have read comments from some of Douglas Reed's followers/supporters and even they raise doubts about some of his more extreme theories, and even his own self delusion.
So even if there is some truth to what he says, perhaps it isn't wise to accept ALL of what ANYONE says, as being complete truth.
Especially in the days of the internet.




Carl Wernerhoff can be contacted by writing to him care of NEXUS, or by email at cwernerhoff@yahoo.com.

HAHAHAHAHA!!

Nexus...well, it's a good magazine if you like science fiction, but thats about it.
I sat down once at a doctors surgery and started reading it, thinking it was a scientific journal of sorts. Not quite. ;) I think the discussion of "mono-atomic gold" with negative mass that had magical properties was enough to make me disbelieve anything that ever comes from that publication.

Terry Syd
20th March 2008, 08:04 PM
Nexus or Sydney Morning Herald, what matters is the truth. I contacted Carl after reading one of his articles. He had done a good analysis of a certain aspect of the cover up. I also note that he has read some of my articles and has used them verbatim within his own articles. I had no objection, as long as the word gets out.

Marc1
20th March 2008, 08:53 PM
Terry you are wrong.
It is not the truth that matters, it is the need to satisfy our own in-build values. That is why it is possible to con such a large number of people with just hot air. People will always believe what they want to believe because it fits their own preconceived bias.
The real number of Jews killed by the Nazis is chicken feed when compared to the Japanese incinerated, maimed, disfigured and condemned to die of cancer by the two American atomic bombs. Yet who is interested in the truth?
After 50 years of war movies portraying Americans as the heroes and Germans as the villains people KNOW the truth.

Terry Syd
24th March 2008, 12:32 AM
I just watched a movie on TV called 'Pearl Harbor'. Definitely a Matrix movie for the blue pill people. Here's the truth about the 'surprise' attack -

Pearl Harbor - Mother of All Conspiracies (http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/pearl/www.geocities.com/Pentagon/6315/pearl.html)