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  • Blending update

    Hi all

    Just an update for anyone interested in blending. I have been running my 79 300D on a 30% Kero blend (should be able to drop to 20 or less for summer) for about 2000km. And all is going well. Car starts fine on cold mornings (it is a bit gutless until it warms up, about 3 mins), no excessive smoking smells sweet too! I have been lucky to get a supply of free canola/soybean oil that is changed daily in the restaurant.
    Fuel economy exactly 10L/100km
    Fuel cost 33c litre
    I cold filter my oil through 3 stages.

    1. Gravity filter. coles "green bags". These really are a fantastic and cheap initial filter. And i would guess about 5 microns as the stage 2 rated filter bag is still clean after 200l+.

    2. Gravity filter 5 micron filter bag sourced from this forum.

    3. Electric water pump. 2 micron house water filter.

    I then put my 30% kero in 25l drums and pump in my oil. From there i loud the drums into my "mobile filling station" - which is a fancy name for a golf cart with a fruit and veg crate on it and a drill pump!- and into the car. Maybe not the most efficient set up but it works for me and i am refining it all the time.
    The total cost for all this including the car is about $1700.
    Give it a go!

    Cheers
    Liam

  • #2
    Re: Blending update

    Hello from a newbie who has been lurking on bio and blending forums for many months. Please advise me if blending is not a suitable topic for this forum,but I need advice on a blend for my 1HZ motor in a HZJ78 Cruiser. Climate here
    (far north of WA) is in 25c to 45c year round, so viscosity would not seem a problem. First results on a blend of 65% WVO, 25% Jet A1(kero) and 10% ULP were excellent, but after a few tanks the motor has excessive diesel "rattle"on the blend hot or cool, esp. on light load. The motor is fine on diesel, and is quiet on deceleration, suggesting excess timing advance when running the (slightly) thicker blend. Has anyone found this problem, and is it possible I have trouble with my pump advance mechanism using the blend? All advice is welcome.

    Regards, Combustor.
    HZJ78 Cruiser on blends in East Kimberley.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Blending update

      Originally posted by Combustor View Post
      Hello from a newbie who has been lurking on bio and blending forums for many months. Please advise me if blending is not a suitable topic for this forum,but I need advice on a blend for my 1HZ motor in a HZJ78 Cruiser. Climate here
      (far north of WA) is in 25c to 45c year round, so viscosity would not seem a problem. First results on a blend of 65% WVO, 25% Jet A1(kero) and 10% ULP were excellent, but after a few tanks the motor has excessive diesel "rattle"on the blend hot or cool, esp. on light load. The motor is fine on diesel, and is quiet on deceleration, suggesting excess timing advance when running the (slightly) thicker blend. Has anyone found this problem, and is it possible I have trouble with my pump advance mechanism using the blend? All advice is welcome.

      Regards, Combustor.
      Combustor.
      It might be a better idea to start your own thread with a heading regarding your vehicle type. You might find some members give blending threads a miss.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Blending update

        Yep. I have been told that there wont be much support for blending here. I suppose it is considered Amateurish. I believe go with what works for you and is within your capabilities.

        Cheers
        Liam

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Blending update

          Originally posted by Liam View Post
          Hi all

          Just an update for anyone interested in blending. I have been running my 79 300D on a 30% Kero blend (should be able to drop to 20 or less for summer) for about 2000km. And all is going well. Car starts fine on cold mornings (it is a bit gutless until it warms up, about 3 mins), no excessive smoking smells sweet too! I have been lucky to get a supply of free canola/soybean oil that is changed daily in the restaurant.
          Fuel economy exactly 10L/100km
          Fuel cost 33c litre
          I cold filter my oil through 3 stages.

          1. Gravity filter. coles "green bags". These really are a fantastic and cheap initial filter. And i would guess about 5 microns as the stage 2 rated filter bag is still clean after 200l+.

          2. Gravity filter 5 micron filter bag sourced from this forum.

          3. Electric water pump. 2 micron house water filter.

          I then put my 30% kero in 25l drums and pump in my oil. From there i loud the drums into my "mobile filling station" - which is a fancy name for a golf cart with a fruit and veg crate on it and a drill pump!- and into the car. Maybe not the most efficient set up but it works for me and i am refining it all the time.
          The total cost for all this including the car is about $1700.
          Give it a go!

          Cheers
          Liam
          Liam hi.
          Why have you chosen to use Kero for blending?, Thinner than diesel?.
          Have been blending with diesel up to 50/50 in my 1991 direct injection rodeo and even in winter no problems starting.

          You will find some good sites re blending in US with merc's and this is a local guy with a newer 300d OZTayls Not sure if he has got around to full conversion yet but he had been blending for sometime now without problems.
          Neil.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Blending update

            Neil
            I use kero because i have a source at $1 a litre. Much cheaper that diesel.

            Nicely said Dave. Couldn't agree more. Plus i find it fun to make my own fuel. Blending is easy and safe, no nasty chemicals like Bio production. Plus 100% of my oil goes into the tank. No purging either. I can see a 2 tank system has advantages. But for simplicity you can't go past blending. Still like i said do what works best for you, your car and your driving habits.
            I don't go nuts like i have seen on the American sites though.
            Can we start a section for blending only?

            Liam

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Blending update

              Originally posted by Dave Jones
              IMHO, The big problem with blending is that it is too simple, too effective and most importantly, No- one can make any money from it selling conversion parts, pumps, heaters or whatever.
              (* Sits back and waits for inevitable flames from the financially motivated. *)
              Of course those making money from selling cooking oil wont be unhappy
              I look forward to seeing how it goes, as there isnt a lot on blending on the forum.
              cheers<BR>Chris.<BR>1990 landcruiser 80, 1HD-T two tank, copper pipe HE+ 20 plate FPHE, toyota solenoids and filters. 1978 300D, elsbett one tank system.<BR>

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Blending update

                Hello,

                I have been bleding since November and honestly, canīt wait to get my hands on the car and covert it.

                For sure blending is simple, but I believe it is not the way to go, at least in the long term.

                Despite I have never gone above 1:1 ratio even in the hottest weather, I have been unable to get rid of some white smoke and this acrid and nasty smell. I am sure this is the result of not burning the oil properly. What this is doing to the engine internals I donīt want to know.

                The fuel filter gets clogged very often, the last one only lasting 2000km.

                These 2 problems can be fixed by installing a FPHE, but this only works when the engine is hot.

                And then we have the problem of cost. If you are willing to find a regular source of WVO, which is becoming very difficult, carry oil around in dirty sticky and heavy containers, filter it, dewater it, take it back to the car, mess around with funnels, spill part of the oil over the car body and have paper towels always handy, then at least make the most of it and donīt pay for diesel fuel. Let that for people who cannot get their nails dirty.

                I installed a two tank system in my previous car and never regretted about it.


                But this is only my view.

                Cheers
                gonzalo

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Blending update

                  I like the idea of blending.

                  Very easy to do and no need to convert the car or worry about changing over or purging etc...


                  In my two tanks system...

                  I drive 5000+ kms every 6 weeks and I use 4 litres of diesel every week for starting up/purging. so 4L X 6weeks = 24 L X $1.67=$40.10 approx.

                  With this system, I only need to store WVO in my garage. Very safe.

                  However...

                  If I am to use a 50% wvo /50% diesel blend, I would use 9 litre/100kms which mean 450 litres of blend. 225 L of diesel X $1.67 = $375.75

                  I have to store Diesel in my garage to blend before every fill ups/top up

                  And ...

                  If I am to use a 85% wvo /15% ULP blend, I would still use 9 litre/100kms which again means 450 litres of blend. 67.5 L of ULP X $1.55 = $104.6

                  I have to store ULP in my garage to blend before every fill up/top up.

                  Because we are all different , I like to think everyone is free to go with whatever makes them happy.
                  Fitian
                  <><

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Blending update

                    Well said Fitian,
                    The option of blending is available to all who wish to use it.
                    To overcome the issues of high melting point oils causing filter blockages you could either cold filter tha oils to remove this component, or if hot filtering the oil is your thing, you could add a fuel heater to the fuel line before the fuel filter(s) in your vehicle.
                    I prefer to blend with Biodiesel and my wife's car runs on a 50% bio/Veggie blend in summer and a 70:30 blend in winter. It has a 10 plate FPHE before the fuel filter, despite having cold filtered oil in the blend. That was how I wanted to use the blend.
                    This car has been using this fuel for 4 years.

                    My cars however only use the blend at startup and purging, as they are equipped with 2 tank conversions.

                    David,
                    How much do you charge for your oil, should I be passing thru your neck of the woods and need a refill?

                    Regards,
                    Tony
                    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

                    Current Vehicles in stable:
                    '06 Musso Sports 4X4 Manual Crew Cab tray back.
                    '04 Rexton 4X4 Automatic SUV
                    '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP) - Wife's car

                    Previous Vehicles:
                    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup.
                    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
                    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Engine donor for W123 coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
                    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel
                    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
                    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
                    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab well body. [Head gasket blew!]
                    '04 Rexton SUV 2.9L Turbodiesel same as Musso - Our Family car.
                    '06 Musso sports Crew Cab Trayback - My hack (no air cond, no heater).

                    Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
                    Adding images and/or documents to your posts

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Blending update

                      Originally posted by Dave Jones
                      This would be far more related to the condition of your engine and its ability to handle veg oil for fuel. If your blending 1:1, I would suggest this problem will very likely get worse when running straight SVO , heated or not. Many people are quick to blame veg for running problems but very few are nearly as quick to take their cars to a mechanic for a going over to make sure the cars are running as they should before they even think of using veg.

                      Then when you start using SVO, you filter will get clogged in 1000KM.
                      Blending will have nothing to do with your filters blocking. This is a problem with your filtering and the quality and cleanliness of your oil before you put it in the car. If you are blending with Diesel at 1:1, on SVO you will be using twice as much oil so the contaminants your leaving it it will block the filters in even less KM.

                      It would be good to review your filtering and drying practices before you go the SVO route because both blending and SVO need clean dry oil to avoid problems such as you are having.

                      No, they can't.
                      The emmissions are most likely due to your car not being in the proper running order in the first place. A common problem is the injectors. You should make sure they are as they should be before you use veg in any way.

                      The only thing a HE would fix would be clogging the filters due to fats. If you are operating your vehicle in hot weather and over decent distances, the filters are easily going to heat up enough to to melt the types of fats that have any place being in your tank in the first place.

                      Knowing your system is unheated, you should only be putting clear oil with no fats in the tank in the first place. If your not doing this the problems amount to operator error and nothing to do with the practice of blending per se.
                      If the filters are not blocking due to fats, they must be blocking due to an inordinate amount of particulates in your oil which is again basically operator error and you should revise your oil preparation as suggested above.

                      Cost???
                      For Blending??
                      That would be some filters you would need just the same as if you were running a 2 tank system and some Buckets or drums. I get mine free from restaurants and industrial areas.
                      If a person had to pay for them, the cost could not possibly compare to what people outlay to build a bio processor or to convert their vehicles to 2 tank.

                      The cost of a litre of fuel may be higher over the long term than bio or SVO but the initial outlay is incomparable. I myself always find it a lot easier to find $50 as one would spend to begin blending than the say $1000 it would cost to do a conversion yourself or set up a decent Bio processor.
                      One is a no brainier spend that is literally an out of wallet purchase and the other is an investment I have to plan for and consider.

                      As for finding oil sources and carrying around sticky tins, how is that any different to using veg fuel in any other way or how could you avoid it by going 2 tank or Bio?
                      I have done them all and that is just the fundamental requirement of veg use.
                      I am not sure the condition of my engine is an issue. Running on diesel fuel, performance, fuel consumption and emisions are all right. These tend to be good indicators of the fuel system state.
                      However I wonīt say the engine couldnīt do without new injector nozzles.
                      As for the filtering, I cold filter my oil to 5 microns before pouring it into the tank. The oil is totally clear, with no fats or clouds whatsoever.
                      This thing with onboard filters clogging is still beyond me, but I know for sure that WVO can clogg them easily even after 5 micron cold filtering.

                      Surely the filter gets hot after a long drive, but I can still touch it for several seconds. This is probably not hot enough.

                      The smoke and smell can be a matter of perception after all. The smoke and acrid smell I complain about may be totally acceptable to another WVO user. This is quite subjective.

                      And what I meant by finding sources of WVO and carrying it around is that of course you wonīt avoid having to do this with a 2 tank system, but at least you will benefit big time by not having to pay for your fuel.

                      What I am trying to say is that if you get into this WVO, I believe the best option is to go all the way. Blending is for me putting together the disadvantages of both fuels.

                      But as Fitian says, here there are options for everybody.

                      Regards
                      gonzalo

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Blending update

                        For those who do a lot of kms like you Fitan a 2 tank system is likley more cost efficient than blending (unless you have free oil and blend fuel). My partner and myself use the Merc for work and drive it 6 days a week that is still only about 160km a week. so for my relatively short trips blending was the go for me.
                        No need to get so excited. Each to their own.....
                        I was hoping that people who blend could share their experiences and blends not argue about it...

                        Liam

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Blending update

                          Originally posted by Liam View Post
                          For those who do a lot of kms like you Fitan a 2 tank system is likley more cost efficient than blending (unless you have free oil and blend fuel). My partner and myself use the Merc for work and drive it 6 days a week that is still only about 160km a week. so for my relatively short trips blending was the go for me.
                          No need to get so excited. Each to their own.....
                          I was hoping that people who blend could share their experiences and blends not argue about it...

                          Liam
                          Would seem I'm stuck in the middle.
                          I have two cars, an old ute that does not do many k's so I blend, and my
                          daily drive about 20000km per year. in search of the perfect car to convert to full SVO.
                          It would seem most members have some kind of experience with blending but eventually continue on to full conversion for reasons above. As you have mentioned "Each to their own".

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Blending update

                            Originally posted by Liam View Post
                            I was hoping that people who blend could share their experiences and blends not argue about it...
                            Liam

                            Liam,

                            In this thread, I can only see that we all shared our blending expereinces. If you are hoping for more info, then you should have searched the forums for "blending" before you start a new thread for nothing.

                            I do not see any form of arguement in this thread. Could you please point it out.
                            Fitian
                            <><

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Blending update

                              Fitan
                              I didn't think i was starting a thread for nothing. I thought it might be useful to share my current experiences with blending. I have searched extensively and am not after any particular information.
                              I noticed what i thought to be some irritation in some of the posts.
                              If i am mistaken i stand corrected.

                              Liam

                              Comment

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