If a company is in the position whereby they currently recieve all excise, all tax, all duty etc. back for petroleum diesel products; in those with an in depth knowledge of the current biodiesel taxation situations opinion, would they find themselves in any different situation should they purchase biodiesel?
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Taxation Arrangements
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
Hi there
Thanks for the chat today
To the best of my knowledge the case of tax on biodiesel is that it is excise neutral
That is the producer will get the rebate from the Government equal to the amount charged at the pump by the retailer
Fuel at present has 38.13 odd cents excise applied to it plus GST
So if it enters "domestic consumption" excise by the manufacturer has to be paid prior the distributor/retailer
They get paid the retail price plus gst on the excise paid fuel
The manufacturer then claims the excise back
He can elect to sell the fuel on less the excise by nominating the point of sale where he sold to who can then claim the excise back
At the end of the day biodiesel is excise free apart from the excise paid by the manufacturer for the Methanol used in the process
This point is in a grey area in so far as the renewable fuels excise is concerned
There is however a further claim of 19.38 odd cents that is available for renewable or green fuels use for trucks of greater than 4.5 tonne
under the renewable energy scheme I also think it may apply for off road use
I am not fully appraised with the intricacies of the scheme so do not take this verbatim
There is a site, I think sustainability and enviroment that explains the whole green fuels scheme
Cheers
ChrisCheers
Chris
Never give up :)
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
I think to claim the exice back the biodiesel needs to meet the Australian standard. Sounds fair?
Except to see if it does meet australian it will cost you about $2000, including sending some of your oil overseas to be tested as it cant be done in Australia.
I think the Govt did something that sounds reasonable, but really isn't.cheers<BR>Chris.<BR>1990 landcruiser 80, 1HD-T two tank, copper pipe HE+ 20 plate FPHE, toyota solenoids and filters. 1978 300D, elsbett one tank system.<BR>
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
Originally posted by Captain EchidnaI think to claim the exice back the biodiesel needs to meet the Australian standard. Sounds fair?
Except to see if it does meet australian it will cost you about $2000, including sending some of your oil overseas to be tested as it cant be done in Australia.
I think the Govt did something that sounds reasonable, but really isn't.
It can be done in Australia I have posted a link to that prior
But you need about $5 K if you want the full ASTM test
Now that is fair?
The dino fuel mobs of course test every batch that they make don't they now?
Haven't you seen all of those Government dudes going around the service stations taking samples to make sure that the fuel complies?
I have been run over by them a few times
For yours and anyone else's info the addition of 10% of anything in dino diesel does not have to be disclosed
Where do you think that most of the biodiesel that is produced in this country goes?
Into dino mate, and no one knows about it
How? simple just mix it pump it out into diesel driven vehicles and increase your margin by a few cents a litre Better still claim the rebate back from the boys you seem to place your trust on so much
How is it that on the one hand every one is bagging the Canberra clowns and on the other hand expect them to do the bloody policing of every aspect of life?
Go figure
Cheers
ChrisCheers
Chris
Never give up :)
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
Chris
It's shocking isn't it that all Bio is mixed with Dino without most people knowing about it.I think it's only a fraction of people associated with the Industry is in the know.
Well if we had a defined policy that would stop.
We do need to lobby real hard for it.These guys are making a quick buck right in front of our eyes...b.....ds.
They will rot in hell.Even hell won't have a area for them.
Cheers
Sauman
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
What is worse Sauman is in some case's with the looks of the fuel that pumps from VP's pumps at time they appear to be B100 so if you work that through you are buying B100 for say $1.15L gate price, then take into account transport of whatever and then sell it to the customer at $1.35 (ingleburn)
Now either transport is costing 15-18c/L or they are making a HUGE profit!
$1.35 is a good price as everyone buys it to save money but it is just good enough to make them look goodDave
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
Hi All
Look guys, really is not an issue of how the stuff is sold
Is it not the case that we as a group of pro bio fuels wish to see more and more people using it?
Biodiesel is manufactured and sold in the market place without the buyer being aware of it does it really matter?
The point is this, as much dino fuel has been replaced by biodiesel
In so far as I am concerned that is a good thing
I am still trying to figure out why the stuff is not priced higher then dino diesel as it should be
May be emission taxes on dino diesel is the answer, with the tax applied to the promotion of renewable fuels while the price of biodiesel is about where dino is at the present
May be I should not have said that since I am sure I will get a lot of flack out of it
The point is that if biodiesel provides all of the benefits that it does why should then be sold at a discount to a product that is so damaging
It is a paradox that better products attract a higher price than inferior ones in any market
It is not the case with biodiesel WHY?
Since I have already opened a can of worms with the above, Here is another one
The sooner participants in this as well as other biofuel forums stop talking about how cheap they run their cars on biodiesel the better the whole movement would be
Cheers
ChrisCheers
Chris
Never give up :)
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
Originally posted by ChrisThe sooner participants in this as well as other biofuel forums stop talking about how cheap they run their cars on biodiesel the better the whole movement would be
Cheers
Chris
I am going to jump in here now
I am with you Chris I have said in other non Bio Fuel forums the best thing to happen would be for the price of Fossil Fuels to be well over the $2/l mark it would make the population stand up and be counted. Bio is from what I can tell about were it should be if it was completly excise free about $1.15-20/l but the issue is that it will be less attractive if they dropped the excise from fossil fuels or removed the grant to cover the excise that they charge on BD.
Originally posted by ChrisLook guys, really is not an issue of how the stuff is sold
Is it not the case that we as a group of pro bio fuels wish to see more and more people using it?
Biodiesel is manufactured and sold in the market place without the buyer being aware of it does it really matter?
If for example VP is as we think they are selling it as B100 then there is going to be problems with it especially with the general population not knowing enough about it to really understand the possible problems with going from 100% dinodiesel to 100%BD and dealing with the scum that gets cleaned out. From all the Mech's that I have spoken about they all said it was bad for the engines. None could tell me why only thats what they had been told from people from the oil companies and alike were they buy their supplies from. They had been given all these horror stories of truck stuck on the Hwy with gunk in their IP after the colapse of the filter due to over load of scum etc etc. I think the way it's sold needs to be carefully monitored and controled. I don't mind if the blend it like B20 or for that matter B50 as they seem to have a much smaller/slower reaction than B100 and would cause less sudden problems. I like that it is replacing the quanitity of dinodiesel that is being sold but if we are not careful it could backfire and blow up in our face and BD could be a restricted fuel as it cause's to much trouble for the general no idea public. If we don't want something like this to happen then we need to make sure inform and the correct information gets out there and the biggest one of these is WHAT IS THE BLEND QTY?
Ok I will get down off my soap (pun intended) box and move on to the next subjectDave
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
Originally posted by Chev28Where is that link please Chris?
I posted it up on the 13th June in this very forum
Took a search to find though
It was posted in the containarised plants Brisbane chapter
http://www.itscb.com/newsitetest/ser...ustralia.shtml
Good luck
Cheers
ChrisCheers
Chris
Never give up :)
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
Originally posted by JackaI am going to jump in here now
Bio is from what I can tell about were it should be if it was completly excise free about $1.15-20/l but the issue is that it will be less attractive if they dropped the excise from fossil fuels or removed the grant to cover the excise that they charge on BD.
Any commercial vehicle operator (Individual, Partnership or Company) who is in a position to claim GST and Fuel Excise back from the ATO would also be able to do so using a Tax Invoice from Rutherford. In fact, even Volume Plus receipts would be claimable providing they issue a proper Tax Invoice receipt for the purchase. Curiously, if their supplier (Moama, Vic) does claim back the excise, because VP are "Not selling BD ", then an operator would also be able to claim the excise for a second time.Mazda's Secret Service motto: "Tell 'em nothing, charge 'em double".
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Re: Taxation Arrangements
VERY intresting Gunner. Not yet seen the invoice from rutherford as I have not purchsed from there yet.
Intresting to see that they can put it on the market paying for everything and still have a gate price of 115c/L
Hmm drop the 38c/L Excise and you have a very affordable fuel. HMMMMMMM very intresting indeed. Someone has already set a feedstock base price and is doing it commercially so there is a standard.
Might have to go buy me some BD so I can get a receipt and go to local Pollie and PUSH him to push in Gov to get things changed.Dave
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