Global warming and J. Howard

[Terry Syd Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Terry Syd]

Here's a recent Age article on Howard's attitude towards the Kyoto protocols. I loved this line -

"Meanwhile, Mr Howard said terrorism was a greater threat to Australia in the future than global warming."

http://www.theage.com.au/news/Nation...431715335.html

[Robert Administrator Find all posts View Profile Close Robert]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

Yeah, I also had a chuckle at that one. (gotta laugh or you'll cry). I also liked how he said he dismissed Mr Gore's message, but also said he had not yet watched the film he had been sent (how could he dismiss the message without hearing it?).
Even better, I liked how he said:

"And I believe the methods he proposes will do a lot of short and medium term damage to the Australian economy,"..."It will send industries offshore..."

As we all know, the most important things to consider would be the short and medium term and the economy .

Imagine industry having to look offshore? Think ABG for one since he cut them off at the knees in his latest back stab to biofuels recently. They are not really bothering trying to compete in the Australian marketplace anymore and are instead looking for markets overseas. Think many renewable energy opportunities. Think of all the other biodiesel industries in every other country who can get carbon credits under the Kyoto agreement (Aust and the US are the only ones not signed on). But I'll stop my rambling.

[Captain Echidna Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Captain Echidna]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

I dont watch the new much as I find it depressing, but have more Australians been killed in Australia by stingrays in the last year than terrorists? Let alone heart disease, drink driving, colesterol? I think John may be a bit over the top saying terrorists are a big problem. The probability of being killed by a terrorist may have even gone up 10 times, but I think it is still bugger all.
Mind you I guess if John still goes on about terrorists, it is probably easier to say "havent I done a good job of fixing that" than if he tries to say something like "lets try and fix global warming"

Message to John- we live in the environment, not the economy.

[Terry Syd Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Terry Syd]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

Johnnie's just reading from the script prepared by his overseas friends. As far as people being killed by terrorists in Oz, you may want to do some research on the Port Arthur Massacre. Johnnie's right, terrorism in Oz can be a problem, the bigger question to focus on is, "who's doing the terrorism?"

Sorry Robert if I got a bit off topic, I should never have taken that RED pill!

Good line, "we live in the environment, not the economy" - I'm going to use that.

[Captain Echidna Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Captain Echidna]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

Yeah, I had meant to put the "in the year" after terrorists, not before. (Mind you on that definition, there was a massive terrorist attack on the country 200 years ago so it could be argued )
Nice to know I am not the only one to consider myself to have taken a red pill!

[Matt Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Matt]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

Johnnie plays on the minds of those that really do not think too much and he plays the cards of fear, uncertainty and doubt together with a good dose of its bad for business (What will it be for us?) on Kyoto.

He is a fearmonger and tells porkies all the time (Children over here, never!). Let alone trying to think or ever be wrong on anything. He is a denyier of the worst sort and has his head so far up something he sees daylight from the other end.

End of rant
Matt

[Terry Syd Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Terry Syd]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

Chris, since you have taken the RED pill, contact me privately. I have found a map of the Rabbit Hole that you may want to look at - the hole is a lot deeper than I thought. All the dots are now connected.

(And I used to think Geroge Orwell was prescient. All he did was a bit of research and then used some fictional stories to convey what he had found.)

By the way, I found no mention of biofuels on the other side of the looking glass.

[Captain Echidna Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Captain Echidna]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

Will pm you for the map of the rabbit hole.

[smokey2 Member Find all posts View Profile Close smokey2]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

Fairly sure on this one.
More people will die in bushfires in Aust this year as a result of global warming than any terrorist attack that is likely to happen in the future. From Qld to Tasmania it is dry but unfortunately little Johnny is also blind as well as hearing impaired. a repeat of Ash Wednesday 1983 is very likely with 74 people dead.

Sorry Jacko But
We are in the mother of all droughts. A constant steady stream of highs across the continent. Fire indexes in NSW last weekend topped an all time high. I lived through one ash Wednesday and the thought of another makes me shake with terror. Went up a bush track during that one with 3 other trucks. Half hour later only 2 of the crews were still alive.

Changing snow conditions are not only affecting Australia but most of Europe as well - so SBS tells me.

Take a trip to the high country of either NSW or Vic and you will notice the changes. I don't mean the dead timber from 2003 but the total lack of moisture in the ground and along the rocky embankments on the roadside that normally trickle with water.

Even my friend at the BOM is starting to accept there is a problem with the weather patterns. Burning off even at this time of the year is becoming a risk.

Maybe it ain't global warming but something is happening to the weather and I and many others believe there is a link.

Captain Echidna - details of deaths in 1983 are detailed on the CFA site and make a good read for anybody in a bushfire prone area. Poor practices played a part but the biggest problem was the dryness of fuel and the wind change. A study, Civilain Deaths, Country Fire Authority

Main thing is to plan ahead.
Block any areas of buildings where embers may enter.
Remove fuel and ignition points from within a meter of buildings.
Reduce as much fuel as possible within 30 meters of buildings.
Drink lots of water, Dress appropriately and do not evacuate at the last minute.

[Jacka Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Jacka]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

More people will die in bushfires in Aust this year as a result of global warming than any terrorist attack that is likely to happen in the future.

I don't want to get into the political debate but I would have to take you to task over that statement.

What has global warming got to do with the bushfire problems in AUS?

I am sure in AUS the bush and undergrowth used to get burned on a regular basis but in the recent > 100 years of history we have stopped burning and in some case's a lot of places haven't burned for 25 or 30+ years which has caused a huge buildup of fire load.


What does any of this have to do with global warming? Did global warming force use to stop burning the bush or is it that we just think we know better than those who lived here for 1000's of year before us.


If you are going to make a statement like that then leave out the bit that is not factual. Global warming has nothing to do with the fire conditions that we are currently experiancing, and neither does the drought as we have had this type of sever drought in the past as well even in our recorded history in the early 20th century. It is just a result of our lack of understanding on how to manage the australian enviroment and how it was managed in the past.

[Captain Echidna Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Captain Echidna]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

My thoughts are perhaps the fire risk is both due to global warming and poor fire management. I am wary of arguments saying things arent global warming, as the conclusion is "continue as normal, no need for change in fossil fuel use"
Mind you as for being in the mother of all droughts, I have heard of people refering to the "time in the past when it rained" and resigning themselves to this situation not being a drought, but permament.
And if 73 people die in bushfires caused by poor practices, and one dies from a bushfire made worse by global warming, will it still be more people than have died in terror attacks in Australia in the last 12 months? (or the next 12 months?)

[F2007 Biofuels Forum Newbie Find all posts View Profile Close F2007]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

What will happen if crude oil price will be 20 USD per barrel?
Prices forecast
Petroleum prices forecast 2007 - article

How will cause low petrol prices to global warming?
What will happen then to bio fuels?

[otherside532 Member Find all posts View Profile Close otherside532]

Re: Global warming and J. Howard

POLITICIANS, the INTERNATIONAL MONEY LENDERS (DEBT PEDLARS) and the GLOBALIZATION promoters are the biggest threat to the future. Go check out the Bildeberger website and see who the members are