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Thread: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
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    Tasmania
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    502

    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    You could also use one of these copper flow through ones, they are the ones I've used for many years and never had a problem with them blocking or failing and they are small, so fit where ever you want them to.

    http://www.helton.com.au/

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    Quote Originally Posted by Alga View Post
    You could also use one of these copper flow through ones, they are the ones I've used for many years and never had a problem with them blocking or failing and they are small, so fit where ever you want them to.

    http://www.helton.com.au/
    Several years ago, I compared flat plate heat exchangers with the Helton dual coil heat exchangers and found them to be much less efficient. I posted results on the forum but with photobucket now in the ransom business they may no longer be available. As Yendor is looking for a high temperature, I recommend a flat plate heat exchanger. I used them on several vehicles and also never had a blockage or other issue with them either.
    I
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel single tank using 95% used cooking oil and 5% to 10% misfuel (where someone had filled diesel vehicle with petrol).
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab. Running on used cooking oil with 5% to 10% misfuel.
    Toyota Camry Hybrid - (Wife's Car)

    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup. Died when supercharger stuck at max boost for weeks. Stretched head bolts.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Donor for current Fatmobile coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    Parts Car C220 1993 All body panels, headlights, interior engine and ECU available.


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  3. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
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    Tasmania
    Posts
    502

    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    Agree with you Tony, but have my HE before the in line filter and have found using a flat plate, it can block if their is anything in the oil. But the Helton allows any junk through to the filter and ended up taking of my flat plates and putting Heltons on every engine. Also have my heltons wrapped in thick insulation and they work so much better that way, the oil is so hot it can burn when changing an in line filter on the road.

    Got a bit lazy over the decades and even though my oil goes through a fuge, the system after that can get junk into it sometimes, especially when possums get into the oil room and decide to crap everywhere and eat the scraps from the fuge.
    Last edited by Alga; 25th July 2017 at 11:48 AM.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Port Macquarie
    Posts
    6

    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    Some interesting feedback although the Toyota heater lines are not getting above 65 Celsius due to the design of where they are plumbed into the engine. This seems to be a design of this particular 3litre turbo diesel model so using a heat exchanger will not achieve much if the water temp is not the same as the cooling system. Thanks Tony for the belittling comments about quote"No one who understands anything about automotive cooling systems would plumb the fuel heater to the radiator!" did not understand what i meant when trying to figure out how to connect to the discharge side of the water pump where the water should be the highest temperature. Maybe Mercedes are different.
    I did order a KEENOVO wrap around 90 deg electric heater that totally covers the oil filter right before the injector pump which i am yet to wire in and hope will sort out my problem. Thanks again for your advice Alga.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    WA
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    4,095

    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    Yendor,
    My comment was in relation to your post where you wrote:
    I have been talking to a mechanic that has done many conversions and ha tells me that using the heater hose lines i will never get up to 82deg as they restrict the flow for the heater box unless you can plumb it into the radiator directly.
    It was obviously aimed at the mechanic who was advising you to plumb the heat exchanger into the radiator. This is not where the hottest water in the engine cooling system is located, as described further in that post.


    In all of the vehicles I have owned, the thermostat restricts coolant flow until the opening temperature is reached. With some of these engines the thermostat directs coolant back to the engine until the thermostat opens, when some or all is directed to the radiator, depending on the coolant temperature. All of these vehicles have had provision for a heater in the cabin of the vehicle and this usually connects to the engine (at the head and returns to near the water pump). This coolant heats up fastest of any coolant in the system, which is why it is used for cabin heat. If the heater restricts coolant flow thru your heat exchanger, when in series wit the heater, then plumb the heat exchanger in parallel with the heater, using the same source and return connections. This will give you the hottest coolant available from your engine. If this impacts on the efficiency of your heater, then a restriction in the coolant line to/from the heat exchanger will restore heater performance without impacting the heat exchanger performance significantly.
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel single tank using 95% used cooking oil and 5% to 10% misfuel (where someone had filled diesel vehicle with petrol).
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab. Running on used cooking oil with 5% to 10% misfuel.
    Toyota Camry Hybrid - (Wife's Car)

    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup. Died when supercharger stuck at max boost for weeks. Stretched head bolts.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Donor for current Fatmobile coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    Parts Car C220 1993 All body panels, headlights, interior engine and ECU available.


    Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
    Adding images and/or documents to your posts


  6. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    sydney
    Posts
    239

    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    My experience aligns with pretty much all that has been posted. Especially not bothering using any electronic fuel heating system.
    I have had the two 20PHEs block up however after many years of use with polymer material.
    Been able to clear one of them and reinstalled but can't seem to shift the blockage in the other despite lengthy soaking in ULP and many attempts blowing through with compressed air.
    Re the eBay link to the stainless 30PHE (300mm long), would it matter much if this was mounted horizontally once the flow directions had been established?
    Laurie
    Last edited by Lozzer; 26th July 2017 at 10:02 PM.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    WA
    Posts
    4,095

    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    I recommend that it is laid on its back (opposite side to the I/O ports, as shown in the ebay listing I linked), but the back could be on a slope from 0 to 90. That way, there would be minimal air trapped in the heat exchanger.
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel single tank using 95% used cooking oil and 5% to 10% misfuel (where someone had filled diesel vehicle with petrol).
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab. Running on used cooking oil with 5% to 10% misfuel.
    Toyota Camry Hybrid - (Wife's Car)

    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup. Died when supercharger stuck at max boost for weeks. Stretched head bolts.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Donor for current Fatmobile coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    Parts Car C220 1993 All body panels, headlights, interior engine and ECU available.


    Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
    Adding images and/or documents to your posts


  8. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    sydney
    Posts
    239

    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    Thanks Tony.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    128

    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    Best thing is a hot shower unit from a 4WD store http://www.4wdworld.com.au/Glind-Car-Boat-Showers.html

    The black thing in the middle is the heat exchanger - plumb it into your cooling system and you can use the other two ports for heating water for your shower, or, in thius case, just plumb your fuel lines through them

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    WA
    Posts
    4,095

    Re: Pre Heating WVO before injector pump

    Mark, that heat exchanger is similar to the Helton one I tested several years ago. If you need a lot of heat, then a FPHE is the solution. The same amount of work installing it even a 10 plate FPHE gives a lot more heat than one of those.
    If you only need a little heat, just do a 5-10% ULP/95-90% Veggie blend in the veggie tank. Much easier and cheaper than mucking around installing a heat exchanger.
    Last edited by Tony From West Oz; 2nd October 2017 at 02:55 AM.
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel single tank using 95% used cooking oil and 5% to 10% misfuel (where someone had filled diesel vehicle with petrol).
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab. Running on used cooking oil with 5% to 10% misfuel.
    Toyota Camry Hybrid - (Wife's Car)

    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup. Died when supercharger stuck at max boost for weeks. Stretched head bolts.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Donor for current Fatmobile coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    Parts Car C220 1993 All body panels, headlights, interior engine and ECU available.


    Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
    Adding images and/or documents to your posts


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