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Thread: Generator question

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Lismore NSW
    Posts
    324

    Generator question

    HI guys,

    We're moving slowly along, the containers have been moved to the new property and the sound proofing of the water cooled unit works extremely well, there is only a small humming noise at the boundary fence, which is fine for me, the exhaust smoke is a different matter, but we'll see. The first batch of bio has been made, the generator warmed up to 73 deg in the container, and I have just fitted 2 temperature controlled exhaust fans to keep it down in summer.

    Since the water cooled unit is on the new property I purchased a 6.6kva second hand ABLE aircooled unit to back us up on a rainy day while we're still on the old property.
    The unit was used on a service truck to power tools (drills and so on) I don't think it has been run to it's higher capacity.

    Now here is the question, If I plug in the charger for the battery bank, the amps go up to about 10, which is about 2.4kw roughly, as soon as I turn on the water pump or other devices, the genie struggles and shuts down. I have changed the fuel filter but no difference. I have heard that a generator is the happiest around 75% of its max capacity.

    Since this particular unit may only have run a few drills and probably idled along most of the time I guess its kind off clogged up.

    Is there any way to 'de-clogg' it? I was thinking along the lines of using heating fans and slowly increase the load by increasing the temperature.

    Any thoughts?

    Thanks and have a great Friday evening!

    Jens
    1990 Toyota Hilux LN106 with ATG 2 tank system (sold after running 150.000 ks on mainly WVO)
    1993 Toyota 75 Series with 1 HZ engine both 75l factory tanks and a custom 170l under tray tank.
    200.000km 80% on bio 10% on WVO 10% on dino,

    "him who never made a mistake, made no discovery either"


  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    43

    Re: Generator question

    Hi Jens
    On low load the cylinder bores glaze up and you start losing compression and increase lubricant oil use.
    Just load it up and work it hard

    Quote Originally Posted by Bueff View Post
    HI guys,

    We're moving slowly along, the containers have been moved to the new property and the sound proofing of the water cooled unit works extremely well, there is only a small humming noise at the boundary fence, which is fine for me, the exhaust smoke is a different matter, but we'll see. The first batch of bio has been made, the generator warmed up to 73 deg in the container, and I have just fitted 2 temperature controlled exhaust fans to keep it down in summer.

    Since the water cooled unit is on the new property I purchased a 6.6kva second hand ABLE aircooled unit to back us up on a rainy day while we're still on the old property.
    The unit was used on a service truck to power tools (drills and so on) I don't think it has been run to it's higher capacity.

    Now here is the question, If I plug in the charger for the battery bank, the amps go up to about 10, which is about 2.4kw roughly, as soon as I turn on the water pump or other devices, the genie struggles and shuts down. I have changed the fuel filter but no difference. I have heard that a generator is the happiest around 75% of its max capacity.

    Since this particular unit may only have run a few drills and probably idled along most of the time I guess its kind off clogged up.

    Is there any way to 'de-clogg' it? I was thinking along the lines of using heating fans and slowly increase the load by increasing the temperature.

    Any thoughts?

    Thanks and have a great Friday evening!

    Jens
    Harvey
    1983 BJ42 Landcruiser
    1997 C250TD Mercedes-Benz

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Sydney, NSW
    Posts
    213

    Re: Generator question

    What is the total electrical load you are putting on the generator? Baseload is 10A or 2.4 kW and you have 6.6kW capacity. Is the additional load of the pumps etc more than 17.5 A / 4.2 kW?
    3DB
    1995 Holden (Isuzu) Rodeo 2.8TD 4X4 - B100 since April 2013
    1976 Mercedes 300D Turbo 'The Coal Grenade' - B100 since May 2016
    (@thirddegreeburns on Instagram)

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    43

    Re: Generator question

    Hi Jens
    I would appreciate your feedback in the next year as to how the ABLE generator does. I see these on eBay for not a lot over $1k and am planning on going off grid battery when the little lady and I move to our sea change property.
    These units appear wvo/bio friendly and at such a wonderful price appear an economical backup for cloudy days.
    Than you and kind regards Harvey
    Harvey
    1983 BJ42 Landcruiser
    1997 C250TD Mercedes-Benz

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    WA
    Posts
    4,152

    Re: Generator question

    Quote Originally Posted by Bueff View Post
    HI guys,

    We're moving slowly along, the containers have been moved to the new property and the sound proofing of the water cooled unit works extremely well, there is only a small humming noise at the boundary fence, which is fine for me, the exhaust smoke is a different matter, but we'll see. The first batch of bio has been made, the generator warmed up to 73 deg in the container, and I have just fitted 2 temperature controlled exhaust fans to keep it down in summer.

    Since the water cooled unit is on the new property I purchased a 6.6kva second hand ABLE aircooled unit to back us up on a rainy day while we're still on the old property.
    The unit was used on a service truck to power tools (drills and so on) I don't think it has been run to it's higher capacity.

    Now here is the question, If I plug in the charger for the battery bank, the amps go up to about 10, which is about 2.4kw roughly, as soon as I turn on the water pump or other devices, the genie struggles and shuts down. I have changed the fuel filter but no difference. I have heard that a generator is the happiest around 75% of its max capacity.

    Since this particular unit may only have run a few drills and probably idled along most of the time I guess its kind off clogged up.

    Is there any way to 'de-clogg' it? I was thinking along the lines of using heating fans and slowly increase the load by increasing the temperature.

    Any thoughts?

    Thanks and have a great Friday evening!

    Jens
    Have you tried running the pumps without the charger running? Will the gennie run them happily? It could be a high start current causing the gennie to bog down.
    Yes, using a number of loads to gradually increase the load on the engine will help.
    You might also try misting water into the intake (after the air filter - wet filter material does not ignite well). It certainly helped restore power in my 300D some years ago.
    I ran it at a high idle (you can do it under load so that would be better) and set the hose nozzle to a fine mist and then aimed the mist across the air inlet to the engine. Do not aim it into the inlet as excessive water in the engine can cause hydrolock. ie. piston coming up to TDC with more water above the piston, than space to occupy it. the piston stops and the crankshaft tries to keep turning, with devastating results. That said, a 3 litre engine at 2000RPM will move 3000 litres of air in a minute, so you should be able to add 1 litre of water a minute easily. Do this at your own peril, as it can cause problems if you are stupid and add too much water, too fast.
    The results of water misting are greater power, cleaner combustion chambers (de-coking), and better fuel economy (from my experience)
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel single tank using 95% used cooking oil and 5% to 10% misfuel (where someone had filled diesel vehicle with petrol).
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab. Running on used cooking oil with 5% to 10% misfuel.
    Toyota Camry Hybrid - (Wife's Car)

    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup. Died when supercharger stuck at max boost for weeks. Stretched head bolts.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Donor for current Fatmobile coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    Parts Car C220 1993 All body panels, headlights, interior engine and ECU available.


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  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Lismore NSW
    Posts
    324

    Re: Generator question

    Hi guys,

    Thanks so much for your replies,

    The pump is a normal pressure pump from our tank, so nothing big, 600w max, I guess. I understand that it takes um to 3 times as much for a second when it is starting up, but that shouldn't effect it too much.

    I certainly will try the water spray method, and will get the heaters going next weekend.

    Thanks again, I shall report back on how we went.

    Jens
    1990 Toyota Hilux LN106 with ATG 2 tank system (sold after running 150.000 ks on mainly WVO)
    1993 Toyota 75 Series with 1 HZ engine both 75l factory tanks and a custom 170l under tray tank.
    200.000km 80% on bio 10% on WVO 10% on dino,

    "him who never made a mistake, made no discovery either"


  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Townsville, North Queensland
    Posts
    620

    Re: Generator question

    Quote Originally Posted by Bueff View Post
    The pump is a normal pressure pump from our tank, so nothing big, 600w max, I guess. I understand that it takes um to 3 times as much for a second when it is starting up, but that shouldn't effect it too much.
    Jens
    Mate you might find the pump draws way more than you think when it starts. Plug it into the generator on it's own and run it through a few cycles. You may be surprised.

    I have a 6.5kVa inverter generator. It has a Eco switch. When Eco is on the engine slows down depending on the load. If I want to start something big, I always turn Eco off until everything settles down.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    In the sunshine state.
    Posts
    857

    Re: Generator question

    Jens, that pump will most likely draw 6 times that at startup typically. Very quickly drops but the inrush will kill a supply. Same issue is facing SA power consumers, get a fault and the system looses frequency stability.
    Biodiesel Bandit

    Landcruiser '98 80 series B100.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Sydney, NSW
    Posts
    213

    Re: Generator question

    Start-up current can be as bad as 10 x run current as others have pointed out. This is related to Power Factor or the ratio of Real Power (kW) to Apparent Power (kVA). If a motor is running very efficiently or has power factor correction, power factor should be close to 1.0. On start up, power factor can be as low as 0.1 for a split second.

    So your 600W pump might have a start-up power of as bad as 6,000VA = 6 kVA

    This is still not 6.6 kVA, so running on its own with no additional load, should be ok???
    3DB
    1995 Holden (Isuzu) Rodeo 2.8TD 4X4 - B100 since April 2013
    1976 Mercedes 300D Turbo 'The Coal Grenade' - B100 since May 2016
    (@thirddegreeburns on Instagram)

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