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Thread: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    45

    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    Quote Originally Posted by AusKiwi View Post
    Thanks for your comment Harvey. Unfortunately I have a common rail diesel so can't run 100% WVO but would like to try maybe up to 10% with other additives to ensure clean burning. What is the best kind of container in your experience? Does it have to be an open pail or can it be a container with a neck? I have a couple of old 10L oil bottles and wondered if the restaurants could fill that assuming they have some kind of drain tap on their fryer.
    Mate, 20 litre plastic containers which are opaque which they probably buy their dishwasher detergent in. This enables you both to easily see the fluid level in them preventing spills.
    Harvey
    1983 BJ42 Landcruiser
    1997 C250TD Mercedes-Benz

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    WA
    Posts
    4,182

    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    I also use the 20L chemical drums for storing filtered oil, ready for use.
    My supplier returns the used oil to the 20L steel drums it came in.
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab. Running on used cooking oil with 5% to 10% misfuel.
    '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP)


    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup. Died when supercharger stuck at max boost for weeks. Stretched head bolts.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Donor for current Fatmobile coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    Parts Car C220 1993 SOLD.
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel single tank using 95% used cooking oil and 5% to 10% misfuel (where someone had filled diesel vehicle with petrol).


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  3. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Gold Coast
    Posts
    11

    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    I am happy to report that I did finally find a local supply of used cooking oil (thanks to Ray of QLD Waste Oils in Molendinar who was generous enough to let me have a 20 litre container of used canola oil, I think it is). So for the last couple of weeks I have been filtering this oil into a 3L bottle and slowly decanting it into the tank a bit at a time. I am now up to about 3-4% (not being over-accurate about it) and the engine is still running fine, if anything a little smoother than usual due to the extra lubricity. I am still adding my usual Pro-Ma DT5 additive, and also 2-stroke oil at 1:200. I will try going up to 5% on the next fill. Will report back later and let you all know how it's all going.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
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    ลึก ประเทศอินเด&
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    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    Hi AusKiwi

    Quote Originally Posted by AusKiwi View Post
    ...and the engine is still running fine, if anything a little smoother than usual due to the extra lubricity.
    Lubricity of the fuel is only beneficial to the well-being of an injector pump that uses the fuel as a lubricant. Diesel fuel in Australia already has the required lubricity.

    Your perceived smoother running is probably due to the placebo affect

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    York UK
    Posts
    117

    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    Quote Originally Posted by tillyfromparadise View Post


    Your perceived smoother running is probably due to the placebo affect
    And probably Not! Years ago When I flew model aerobatics I used supercharged Yamada Four stroke engines. Power was in plenty using fuel with 20% nitromethane. Bonus points were awarded if the noise output was quieter than average. We would over-oil the fuel to make the engines run smoother.

  6. #16
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    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    Hi smithy,

    Quote Originally Posted by smithy View Post
    And probably Not! Years ago When I flew model aerobatics I used supercharged Yamada Four stroke engines. Power was in plenty using fuel with 20% nitromethane. Bonus points were awarded if the noise output was quieter than average. We would over-oil the fuel to make the engines run smoother.
    Wrong again
    You do not understand the difference between a 4 stroke model glow plug engine that mixes oil with the fuel to lubricate the engine and a 4 stroke automotive diesel engine which keeps the lubricating oil separate from the fuel.

    Model 4 stroke engines require their lubricating oil to be mixed with the fuel to provide lubrication for the engine.
    4 stroke automotive diesels do not use their fuel to lubricate the engines. 4 stroke automotive diesels have lubricating oil separate from their fuel and ideally the two never come together.
    The only part of the engine the WVO you use as a fuel sees is the fueling system. The WVO burns immediately it is injected into the cylinder and plays no part in lubricating your diesel engine

    PS-Quieter noise output is not the same thing as smoother running

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Tasmania
    Posts
    517

    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    Quote Originally Posted by smithy View Post
    And probably Not! Years ago When I flew model aerobatics I used supercharged Yamada Four stroke engines. Power was in plenty using fuel with 20% nitromethane. Bonus points were awarded if the noise output was quieter than average. We would over-oil the fuel to make the engines run smoother.
    You're right Smithy, adding BD or vo increases the lubricity and makes engines run smoother. There have been many studies which support this, ultra low sulphur diesel, doesn't have the lubricity to stop wear in many parts of the fuel system and engine, rather it wears them out with the friction it creates. Rotary pumps suffer the most as the fuel lubricates the Ip, I notice the difference when running my series 80 on dino, compared to vo. Others have commented on how smooth and quiet the engine runs, when on VO/BD, compared to using dino.

    There are many recommendations in Europe to buy bd blended dino for better lubricity and longer engine component life, recommended by experts. here are just a couple of scientific articles on the subject.

    https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...76610215013879

    http://jatonkam35s.com/DeuceTechnica...itive_test.pdf

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
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    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    Hi Alga,

    Quote Originally Posted by Alga View Post
    You're right Smithy, adding BD or vo increases the lubricity and makes engines run smoother.
    You are wrong when you said "ultra low sulphur diesel, doesn't have the lubricity to stop wear in many parts"
    Fuel lubricity has not been a concern in Australia since 2002 (before you started using biodiesel or WVO) when they added a lubricity requirement to the Diesel Fuel standard to insure there was no lubricity problem with diesel fuel.

    The biodiesel or WVO does not come into contact with any part of your engine except the fueling system.
    That includes the lift pump, the Injector pump and the injectors
    There are no studies I am aware of that supports the idea that the increased lubricity of biodiesel or WVO makes your engine run smoother.

    Both studies you linked to is concerning adding BIODIESEL (not WVO) as a lubricant to the fuel in place of the chemicals currently being used.
    Neither study you linked to claims engines run smoother because of the increased lubricity of biodiesel.

    If your engine is running better on WVO it is not because of the lubricity of the WVO.
    Last edited by tillyfromparadise; 14th June 2018 at 10:12 AM.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    WA
    Posts
    4,182

    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    Additionally, this vehicle is a Common Rail Diesel which does not have an injector pump, it has a high pressure pump to provide the high pressures in the "common rail". The injectors are piezo injectors, totally different to the older (rebuildable and adjustable (using shims)) injectors.
    Adding veggie oil to the fuel would not have any beneficial effect (as the fuel already has lubricity additives in it) other than a cost saving and may possibly cause issues with the seals in the high pressure pump.
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab. Running on used cooking oil with 5% to 10% misfuel.
    '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP)


    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup. Died when supercharger stuck at max boost for weeks. Stretched head bolts.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Donor for current Fatmobile coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    Parts Car C220 1993 SOLD.
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel single tank using 95% used cooking oil and 5% to 10% misfuel (where someone had filled diesel vehicle with petrol).


    Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
    Adding images and/or documents to your posts


  10. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Tasmania
    Posts
    517

    Re: Blending Diesel with Filtered Vegetable Oil?

    Tony, I have a 671gm common rail, it runs much smoother and quieter in vo. Agree the fuel mostly comes into contact with the fuel system, but as on all engines, there is a certain time in the cylinders where it does add to lubricity, before combusting. It can be claimed as a placebo effect, but it is noticeable, especially when you drive long distances in big rigs, as the engines purr along, compared to dino. There is a noticeable difference when switching over between the two fuels, I put it down to the lubricity of the vo, compared to the almost non existent lubricity of dino. With the Gm, there is a distinct difference in sound and operation, which has been commented on by other large boat owners. A close Cray fisherman friend, says he always knows when I switch fuel because the engine pitch changes. As you may know, GMs tend to scream, hence the name screaming jimmies. Yet when on VO, mine hums along with a distinct drop in decibels. Have no scientific explanation for this and didn't take much notice until it was pointed out to me, you notice it more on deck than in the engine room, or wheelhouse.

    It's also noticeable that very few discuss much on this forum any more, because of the deranged psychopath constantly abusing and insulting others. They add nothing to the discussion, other than abuse and more than likely, have little real hands on experience, other than on one or two car engines around the suburbs.

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