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Thread: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Scone NSW
    Posts
    74

    Question CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    Hi all

    I obtained some info today over the phone regarding Fleetguard CAV filter elements.

    FF167 Flow rate 50 litres/hr 18 microns at 98% and 10 microns at 80%

    FF167A Flow rate 75 litres/hr 12 microns at 98% and 10 microns at 92%

    I've been using the FF167A for veg.



    The Fleetguard replacement I'm using for the standard diesel fuel filter for the 1HD-T.

    FF5159 I'm told information unavailable.



    The Fleetguard twist on replacement, for the coolant heated unit in the UK on ebay that I've got my eye on.

    FF5135 Flow rate 150 litres/hr 16 microns at 98% and 10 microns at 90%
    Except for flow rate the specs are not as good as the FF167A.



    I wonder if the delphi, ryco and other brands are any better?

    Mark.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    863

    Re: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    Hi Mark,

    From experience ... Delphi or ryco elements are better compared to Fleetguard FF167A only when it comes to the micron rating.

    They are however, not good enough for wvo because the flow rate is lower than FF167A.

    I use Fleetguard for the flow rate and since the the wvo I use is cold filtered to 1 micron before going into the tank.

    FF167A will last a lot longer and will cope better if temprature drops.

    cheers
    Fitian
    <><

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Perth Western Australia
    Posts
    932

    Re: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    I believe some filters contain a water coalescing coating that tends to reduce flow for vege users. This feature is good for straight diesel, but seems to have a different effect with WVO.

    I cannot recall whether the filters with the "A" after the name code are the ones with or without the coalescing feature, but from what Fitian is saying, they probably are the ones without.

    Google searches for coalescing filters would give a lot of responses.

    Tim
    Toyota Landcruiser 1988 HJ61 Manual Wagon
    12H-T turbo Direct Injection.
    Twin Tank setup runs on 100% WVO after warm up. 30 plate FPHE with 80C output, 12mm fuel lines
    Start up and shut down electric fuel pump feeds IP direct.
    Front 4WDSytstems Lokka, Rear ARB airlokka for quick escapes up sandhills. Performance GTurbo with 600mm FMIC gives 450nm @ 1700rpm at 20psi boost.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Kyoto, Japan
    Posts
    20

    Re: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    Sorry this not contribute to the answer but instead would like to know is there any online international site where i can get FF167a filters?
    Hilux Toyota Surf
    1993 SSR X
    2 tank WVO

    http://homepage.mac.com/ifd66/pg1.html

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Newcastle
    Posts
    324

    Re: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    Tim the 'A' means it has the coating.

    Peter<><

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    10

    Re: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    Where can I get a high flow rate FF5135? I can't seem to find them anywhere. I keep losing power on hills when I'm running on WVO, seems to just be a flow rate issue cause it runs fine in low power driving.

    Anybody know the flow rate of a Coopers 522?

    Phil

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    WA
    Posts
    4,205

    Re: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    Why are you having flow issues with the CAV????
    18 years ago, I had an AEC Bus (converted to motor home) with a 590 cu in motor which got around 4 km/L. It had 2 CAV's in series but never had an issue with flow restriction.

    It seems to me that you are having issues for a different reason than the make/model of filter.

    What temperature do you heat the fuel to before the filter?
    Is the filter in cool airflow?
    Is it insulated?

    What is blocking the filter?

    Regards,
    Tony
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    2000 Ford Courier Crew Cab 2.5L Turbodiesel on Blended veggie oil.
    '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP)


    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup. Died when supercharger stuck at max boost for weeks. Stretched head bolts.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Donor for current Fatmobile coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    Parts Car C220 1993 SOLD.
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel single tank using 95% used cooking oil and 5% to 10% misfuel (where someone had filled diesel vehicle with petrol).
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab. Running on used cooking oil with 5% to 10% misfuel. [Head gasket blew!]


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  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Perth Western Australia
    Posts
    932

    Re: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    Quote Originally Posted by pwibbip View Post
    Where can I get a high flow rate FF5135? I can't seem to find them anywhere. I keep losing power on hills when I'm running on WVO, seems to just be a flow rate issue cause it runs fine in low power driving.

    Anybody know the flow rate of a Coopers 522?

    Phil
    Phil the FF5135 is not a CAV replacement cartridge - which is what the thread is about.

    I found this FF5135 on ebay from the USA Fleetguard Spin On Fuel Filter Element FF5135 3Pcs - eBay Other, Hydraulics Pneumatics, Industrial Supply MRO, Business Industrial. (end time 29-Aug-10 08:01:16 AEST)


    I find Filter Discounters in Perth are able to source all my filter requirements.

    Filter Discounters for their contact info.

    Seeing the size of the Fleetguard filter you are talking about, I completely agree with Tony - you have other problems you need to resolve - it's not the filter.

    I suspect you have either an air leak that only becomes a problem under the high suction of a power climb, or you have other restrictions such as small fuel lines, blocked pick up in the tank etc etc.

    Tim
    Toyota Landcruiser 1988 HJ61 Manual Wagon
    12H-T turbo Direct Injection.
    Twin Tank setup runs on 100% WVO after warm up. 30 plate FPHE with 80C output, 12mm fuel lines
    Start up and shut down electric fuel pump feeds IP direct.
    Front 4WDSytstems Lokka, Rear ARB airlokka for quick escapes up sandhills. Performance GTurbo with 600mm FMIC gives 450nm @ 1700rpm at 20psi boost.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    10

    Re: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    Thanks Tony... yeah I'd like some help to think through this one... I'm chasing my tail a bit.

    I started with and still use an upflow system with 2 filters , 50mic and 5 mic. This was giving me nice clean fuel to look at, but the CAV filter would block very quickly. For that reason, and that the upflow sytem was so slow, I got hold of a centrifuge which manages to get out the very fine black silt that must have made it through the upflow system. I thought I had solved the problem, but about 2000km later I needed to change the CAV filter again. That is the consistent pattern, first I start to lose power uphills, then it coughs on the flat. If I switch to diesel, no problem. If I change the CAV I get another 2000km. The filters never look real dirty inside. They get little chunks of gel in them though. This doesn't seem to change even if I blend WVO with 40%diesel.

    The CAV is up against the firewall, close to the heat exchanger...don't know what temp the heat exchanger is at for normal running. The CAV is not insulated.

    Any suggestions very welcome.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony From West Oz View Post
    Why are you having flow issues with the CAV????
    18 years ago, I had an AEC Bus (converted to motor home) with a 590 cu in motor which got around 4 km/L. It had 2 CAV's in series but never had an issue with flow restriction.

    It seems to me that you are having issues for a different reason than the make/model of filter.

    What temperature do you heat the fuel to before the filter?
    Is the filter in cool airflow?
    Is it insulated?

    What is blocking the filter?

    Regards,
    Tony

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    WA
    Posts
    4,205

    Re: CAV FILTER ELEMENTS Are there any better ones.

    pwibbip,
    Fuel starvation has similar symptoms, regardless of the cause (lack of fuel flow, or air in fuel line).

    There are 2 tools to use here to better understand what is happening.

    The cheapest is to temporarily install some transparent hose in the fuel line at strategic locations:
    • Before the fuel filter - this tells you if air is entering the fuel system before the filter.
    • After the fuel filter - this tells you if air is getting in at the filter and
    • In the fuel return line - which tells you if the IP is sucking air.

    Some clear hose is not suited for long term use in fuel systems, but is fine for short term usage to identify faults.

    The other tool is to install a fuel pressure/vacuum gauge (depending on the fuel system of your vehicle - does your engine have a fuel lift pump with separate connections to filters, etc [fuel system is under pressure] or is the fuel lift pump integral to the IP? [fuel system us operated at slight vacuum])

    By noting the normal fuel pressure at full load conditions, you can determine when the fuel filter is approaching the end of its service life. Thus, you then change filters when they need replacing, not when the book says so. you can also preempt a blocked filter by replacing it before it blocks.

    If you are suffering loss of power and there is normal fuel pressure, suspect air in the fuel system as a likely cause.

    I hope this is of assistance to you.

    Regards,
    Tony
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    2000 Ford Courier Crew Cab 2.5L Turbodiesel on Blended veggie oil.
    '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP)


    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup. Died when supercharger stuck at max boost for weeks. Stretched head bolts.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Donor for current Fatmobile coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    Parts Car C220 1993 SOLD.
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel single tank using 95% used cooking oil and 5% to 10% misfuel (where someone had filled diesel vehicle with petrol).
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab. Running on used cooking oil with 5% to 10% misfuel. [Head gasket blew!]


    Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
    Adding images and/or documents to your posts


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