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Thread: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

  1. #1
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    Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    I have a 400 litre hot water tank and a 330 litre tank

    400L will be used for heating, mixing and settling

    300L will be used for washing and long term storage

    I will be using KOH


    1) Add 250l oil to reactor
    2) Water test with HPT and if necessary heat and cool cycle to free water and drain

    3) Heat to 55c
    4) Take a small sample for titrating i intend to to use methylated spirits for this and Tumeric
    5) Titrate and get amount for adding to methoxide
    5) Add determined amount of KOH to 50l methanol - gradually and stirring/shaking
    6) run pump for 4 hours to thoroughly mix
    7) leave settle overnight and then drain 50L or until BIO starts coming out
    8) Put this aside for next time as my Glycerol pre rinse
    9) Perform a 3/27 test to ensure good conversion - if not PANIC and scream for help on here !!!
    10) Move to 300 litre drum - water wash until PH of water out is same as water in
    11) Bubble dry
    12) polish with 1 micron filter bag before long terms storage


    I know some of these steps might be over the top but i want to get this right

    Comments please ?

    Craig
    Holden Suburban K2500 1998 6.5L Turbo GM engine
    210,000KMs (90,000 on new crate motor)

    Currently 2 tanks in and working - 90 litre BIO tank and main tank of 160L WVO

    30 plate FPHE in Engine bay and Helton Dual coil in rear
    Walbro FRB-5 pusher pumps x 2

    50,000KM on Veg and 10,000Km on B100

  2. #2
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    ลึก ประเทศอินเด&
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    Re: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    Hi Craig,
    seeing as no one has commented I will make a few.

    #2. I insure the oil is as dry as I want before putting it in the reactor. But then again I have never checked oil for water content except for "eyeballing" it. No doubt some day I will run into trouble doing it this way. 10 years, so far so good.

    #4 Hopefully you are using the World Famous Chopstick Titration Technique (Pat Pend)

    #6 I am not a real fan of pumps, but then I have never used one. Too many people have reported bad results with them. Out of curiosity, what pump are you using?

    #7 What do you mean by "or until BIO starts coming out"

    #9 I never do a 3/27 test on the biodiesel I produce. At my age the last thing I want is bad news. However, if you absolutely must do a 3/27 and it fails, just re-process using the formula 1.4g KOH mixed into 35ml of methanol per litre of biodiesel being reprocessed.

    #10 I never worry about pH. Why would you want to complicate things. If it dries "bright and clear" it is good enough. Bubbling air through the biodiesel with an aquarium pump after it is mist washed works wonders for clarity.

    #11 See #10

    #12 I have never understood the word "Polish" with refrence to biodiesel production. I pour the biodiesel through a 1 micron bag filter immediatly prior to pouring it into my vehicle. And it still clogs my $2 inline sacrificial supercheap fuel filter after a month or two.

    There are many ways to make biodiesel. I am sure yours will work just fine.

    Tilly

  3. #3
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    Thumbs up Re: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    Thanks Tilly - getting the answers from a legend in the community is much appreciated !!

    #2. I insure the oil is as dry as I want before putting it in the reactor. But then again I have never checked oil for water content except for "eyeballing" it. No doubt some day I will run into trouble doing it this way. 10 years, so far so good.

    Yeah - i am just being anal i suppose - my other car runs on this same oil (both in the blend and Main tanks) and i have a standard drying process i follow - usually works well - most of the oil i get is pretty dry to start with


    #4 Hopefully you are using the World Famous Chopstick Titration Technique (Pat Pend)

    Exactly what i am following !!! Then segueing into the 3/27 method that you and Mickey mouse helped to publicise after Jan published it at JTF


    #6 I am not a real fan of pumps, but then I have never used one. Too many people have reported bad results with them. Out of curiosity, what pump are you using?

    QB80 - $50 EBAY special

    Its been pumping oil for me for a while now and working well

    #7 What do you mean by "or until BIO starts coming out"

    I have a 400 litre water heater - twin element, so i have turned it upside and therefore have a true cone bottom. I was planning on draining it slowly until i see the colour change from the Glycerol and then the BIO.

    #9 I never do a 3/27 test on the biodiesel I produce. At my age the last thing I want is bad news. However, if you absolutely must do a 3/27 and it fails, just re-process using the formula 1.4g KOH mixed into 35ml of methanol per litre of biodiesel being reprocessed.

    Yeah i hear you - but if i blow up the injection pump on my new car - the missus will kill me !! I am still having troubles finding a mechanic in Sydney who has worked on the Suburban style of engine before.


    #10 I never worry about pH. Why would you want to complicate things. If it dries "bright and clear" it is good enough. Bubbling air through the biodiesel with an aquarium pump after it is mist washed works wonders for clarity.

    OK i will do it this way then - how many mist washes do you do - i assume you drain the water after the mist wash has had time to settle - prior to bubbling ?


    #11 See #10

    #12 I have never understood the word "Polish" with refrence to biodiesel production. I pour the biodiesel through a 1 micron bag filter immediatly prior to pouring it into my vehicle. And it still clogs my $2 inline sacrificial supercheap fuel filter after a month or two.

    Aah bugger - i was hoping this would not happen on an ongoing basis !! My plan as part of the drying cycle was to use a system that DaveJones first put in, a T with a 1 micron filter on one side and a restrictive tap on the other prior to a spray nozzle - the nozzle side dries the BIO whilst spraying and a certain amount goes through the 1 micron bag over and over again - hopefully picking up more crap along the way and gradually clogging the bag and hence forcing finer filtering than the nominal 1 micron.


    There are many ways to make biodiesel. I am sure yours will work just fine.

    Thanks for taking the time - i appreciate it and will report back


    Tilly
    Holden Suburban K2500 1998 6.5L Turbo GM engine
    210,000KMs (90,000 on new crate motor)

    Currently 2 tanks in and working - 90 litre BIO tank and main tank of 160L WVO

    30 plate FPHE in Engine bay and Helton Dual coil in rear
    Walbro FRB-5 pusher pumps x 2

    50,000KM on Veg and 10,000Km on B100

  4. #4
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    Re: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    I dont think there are that many methods of making biodiesel. I think Tillys point was more about risk assessment.


    I do a 1 litre test from the bottom of the reactor where the water would be if there is any. I inspect by eye. If/when the test batch cracks (99% of the time it does) I proceed with the rest of my batch. If I make a litre of soap, I heat and settle for 24 hours. (or drain off suspect looking oil from bottom.

    6) run pump for 4 hours to thoroughly mix -

    #40 mins at 55 c is ample. Turn it off and go to bed. You did a 1 Litre test batch remember.


    9) Perform a 3/27 test to ensure good conversion - if not PANIC and scream for help on here !!! -

    #never done one. I run my car on vege oil as well. 2 - 3 % unreacted oil is nothing compared to the 50/50 oil/bio ratio I run.

    Bubble dry until glyc stops falling out and bio tastes like butter.

    5 micron sock filter. Haven't changed a fuel filter in 2 years.

    Tilly arrived late at the brisbane meet n greet 1 and announced he was from the TAX office. God bless him.

  5. #5
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    Re: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    guys.

    after reading some of the pointers here, i really need to know,
    is mist washing really needed?

    i have done several batches now, and so far no problems. as i air wash the bio for several days and then let it settle out for another 2 or 3 days, the bio i am getting is realy clear and has hardly any fallout in the bottom of the tank.( i am still yet to do the, it should taste like butter test,) but so far so good.

    today i put another batch thru, with a titration of just 3 points plus base let it do it's thing and i was amazed at how clear the resulant bio was after just a few minutes of settling after the pump was turned off. this is really good oil.

    i see a lot of guys put 5% per volumn of water into the mix before dropping the glyc out of the mix, is this the same thing as mist washing?

    i just need some of you more experienced alchemists to put my mind at ease before any further experimenting is done.

    Cheers.

    Hobe's
    if it's FERAL, it's in PERIL.

    i too belong to P.E.T.A.
    people eating tasty animals.

  6. #6
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    Re: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    As a point of comparison, take your bio that you have air bubbled and settled for a week or so. Then take another batch that you have air bubbled for a few days THEN mist washed to allow the water to clean out the remaining meth/glyc etc.

    Then do a shake em up wash test on both samples. The bubble dried water WILL have some soap in it and may vary from milky to cloudy. The misted bio should have far less. The water from it ought to be very clear.

    Do the test and advise.
    Last edited by joe; 3rd February 2011 at 01:57 PM. Reason: spelling

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    Re: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    " I am not a real fan of pumps, but then I have never used one. Too many people have reported bad results with them. Out of curiosity, what pump are you using?

    QB80 - $50 EBAY special

    Its been pumping oil for me for a while now and working well"

    Just a quick question for those who use pumps to mix bio. What happens when the glycerine settles in the pump and pipes? Do you ignore it and let it go through with the next batch? My glycerine sets solid, could it even prevent the pump from turning?
    Johnnojack
    4WD Isuzu Jackaroo 3.1 170,000km on WVO,(2017) 2 tank home built system 6 solenoids. Mk. 9 version. Improvements under investigation

  8. #8
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    Re: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    craigcurtain all good advice on basically the same method with small differences. I mix for 1 hr and it is done, I believe it depends on how vigorous and violent the mix is I use two qb60 and they turn the entire contents in 4-5 mins. I use 3/27 on 90% of batches because my feedstock is high titrating solid fat, I also do quantitative soap testing ( bromo) because of my feedstock and noticed it can be crytal clear at 200-300 ppm of soap still present. I wash but not mist course sray and only if it is taking to long to settle out soap, most times I can settle it out. I filter it through three filters from 5um 1um & 0.5um then to 5 of 205L drums horzontal and tilted back from the outlets to leave reservouir and still glyc will collect, I decant to 20L drums and this is crystal clear 0 soap and absolutely no drop out.
    Jhono even though my pumps are 100mm and 300mm above the dome bottom I beleive their would still be residual amont of glyc settling but it does not interfere with my acid stage so minimal, they do seize and as such I have cut an aperture in the rear grill and use a small screw driver to manually turn the fan and free the rotor it doesnt take much force and have had no problems at all, pumps are simple easy and work well for me but I have not tried paddles and so cant say that one is better than the other. regards andy

  9. #9
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    Re: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    i use a qb type pump on my reactor, and yes glyc does settle in there.
    i have a way of back flushing the pump using some good bio from the reactor tank after i have drained the glyc in the usual manner.

    a simple 19x19x19 gal t piece at the inlet side of the pump, to which i have fitted an ordinary house tap. i could probably drain all the glyc thru here, but it is a tad too low for my 20 ltr cubies to sit under.

    if i can get a piccie to load up, this would make it a bit clearer for you.

    Hobe's
    if it's FERAL, it's in PERIL.

    i too belong to P.E.T.A.
    people eating tasty animals.

  10. #10
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    Re: Here are the steps i intend to follow for my first batch - comments please

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnnojack View Post
    " I am not a real fan of pumps, but then I have never used one. Too many people have reported bad results with them. Out of curiosity, what pump are you using?

    QB80 - $50 EBAY special

    Its been pumping oil for me for a while now and working well"

    Just a quick question for those who use pumps to mix bio. What happens when the glycerine settles in the pump and pipes? Do you ignore it and let it go through with the next batch? My glycerine sets solid, could it even prevent the pump from turning?
    The way i have designed my tank is that i have two outlets - one about 4 inches up from the bottom and the 2nd in the bottom.

    By judicious use of valves i can flush out all content from the pump - so the plan is after settling and draining all visible from the bottom of the tank, i then manipulate the valves and the last of the oil in the outlet of the pump is flushed back down and through the pump and should then push out all the glycerol in the pipes and pumps.

    I am also using KOH so assume it will all remain liquid.


    Craig
    Holden Suburban K2500 1998 6.5L Turbo GM engine
    210,000KMs (90,000 on new crate motor)

    Currently 2 tanks in and working - 90 litre BIO tank and main tank of 160L WVO

    30 plate FPHE in Engine bay and Helton Dual coil in rear
    Walbro FRB-5 pusher pumps x 2

    50,000KM on Veg and 10,000Km on B100

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