A vehicle we have been running on B100 (2004 Toyota Hilux 3L Diesel 2wd) is now dead.
One day 2 weeks ago we put in $15 worth of normal diesel at the station, there was a small portion of maybe 10% of bio in the tank at the time.
We drove 200m up the road to home, next morning the car failed to start. Upon original ignition a bang then just splutter splutter and smoke.
We presumed fuel filter.
We changed it, and it failed to start.
The fuel that came out of the filter smelled odd, a lot like paint thinners.
We towed it to mechanics (who knows a bit about bio, and has been following our journey)
He suggested something very wrong with our mix, but when I told him I was VERY fussy about following the instructions and the 2 other cars were running like a dream - he was confused.
Then he smelt the fuel and suggested we had put in petrol when he filled up the day before, high octane he said.
We looked at the receipt, nope - Diesel, we went to the station to see if anyone else had complained about bad fuel - nope.
No matter what the mechanic did - it just kept bellowing clouds of grey and black smoke - lots!

A rebuilt fuel pump and all new injectors as well as a heap of other work later we handed over $1800 for repairs.

The mechanic is uncertain about it being bio issues, obviously when 2 other cars are working (80 series cruiser and '94 model Jackaroo) he thinks it may not be, but not sure. But he did suggest the 2004 newer fuel injected engine may not be able to handle the bio... nothing I have heard before, especially in a hilux.
The mechanic noted that the car was in bad condition and in desperate need of a service - belts, oil filters, and many other things needing doing - it was on the mines, and filled with red dirt. Could this be it?

The fuel we took out is in a jar and everyone I let have a sniff says "hmmm paint thinners". Could this be a methanol smell? Why his car only? Where did it come from?

Now, we are very reticent to put any more bio fuel into the car, understandably.

I wonder if you have any thoughts on this issue?

probably to late now but go back to the supplier buy some fuel smell it see what it smells like it could have given you the answer

So its been OK on the biodiesel and then started having problems after you filled up with diesel. I am biased toward biodiesel but in the computer world you look at the last change before a problem started occuring.

Also asking the petrol station if there was a problem, is like asking Sylvester where Tweety Bird is.

If you still have your receipt for the fuel, I'd be toddling off with the repair bill and getting a bit cranky with someone.

If your certain you fuel is in the clear, then they need not know about it as they will not honour your request. They have insurance for just this sort of thing.

Also did the mechanic say the injector and fuel pump needed doing. thats another great trick of mechanics. For all you know there might have been water or ptrol in the tank, which only needed to be cleared out. Or the glow relay might have crapped it and the glow wasn't working or something completely unrelated.

Sorry I'm a complete sceptic. You haven't even said what was wrong with the car. if they pull a car apart like you've said they did, they should at least tell you what the problem was.

__________________
Joe Morgan
Brisbane Biodiesel Site Admin
http://www.brisbanebiodiesel.com

Searching tips using Google - SVO Dual tank systems
SVO, Common Rail and Direct Injection - Vehicles converted to Used Cooking Oil

Grey and black smoke indicates incomplete combustion or overfuelling ie not enough air. I would drop the fuel tank contents and refill with some known fuel.

I had water in a common rail engine one time, lucky it has a lift pump. Not sure where it came it had some diesel in it too but ass my landcruiser was running on the same fuel and showed none I have my suspicions.

Diesel engines are robust and will run on nearly any oil but not water. Petrol will work as long as timing is retarded. Dry and bad for it but it does work.

Matt

__________________
Biodiesel Bandit

Landcruiser 98 B100 (100,000km and still going)
Peugeot 306 xtdt B100
Peugeot 2004 2L 307 HDI Does not like B100

Gday dave
I would have to disagree on the tyre issue bio definitly makes my tyres wear out faster
thanks caveman

Before all the repairs the mechanic emptied your tank (and saved the contents which can now be tested) and cleaned out all the fuel lines.

The vehicle was filled with good fuel and it still refused to start? So the mechanic did stuff to make sure there was a fuel flow and it was getting to the injectors - mechanical sort of stuff.

Still no go so the pump was rebuilt and it now works.

It appears to me that something was damaged.

Get the fuel tested and stat dec from the mechanic about what he did.

When it comes back (fuel test) and assuming the results say what you have should never be put in a diesel motor then go back to the servo.

Diesels can run on just about anything.

Of course it may be a coincidence and something did fail just after filling the vehicle.

Get the name of the attendant you bought the fuel from as well as the one who said there had been no complaints.

Was it a branded fuel station or an owner operated one?

If you are considering trying to get your money back you probably have a bit of a process to go through

good luck

Geoff

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Telegraph Point NSW
Landcruiser GXL '96 - 80:20 blends
Pug 1.6 HDi - 308 Touring Wagon - definitely not game :-)
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Telepoint - Heat Exchange & Filter Bags

Ok, OK - VERY funny guys
I enjoyed your sarcasm, I also am still enjoying driving my Jackaroo on B100 while my poor mate trembles at the thought of putting in bio to that tank again, yes, my tyres seem to be wearing fast and my weekends wasting away as I travel out camping so much more as it costs me so much less!

But - In answer to some of your questions...
Yes, the tank was dropped before any work was done, emptied and filled with dino and tried starting again. A fuel flush was done and so on and so forth before fuel pump and injectors as last resort.
The mechanic ( a decent guy - seriously!) did all of what Geoff suggested before taking more drastic measures. He too suggests this is NOT a bio diesel issue. I guess part of my hope in posting this was to get exactly the kind of response I have so I can convince my mate to get back on that horse...and fill the tank one more time! I have more than enough oil in my shed for us all! I think I will return to Sylvester and ask where Tweety bird is (Joe!)

I guess from here we need to get this fuel tested...and start a long process!

Oh, we did go back and smell the fuel and it smelt like diesel.
We also looked at the receipt (computerized from the bowser) and it read "diesel", so I am sure he didn't use the wrong pump...hmmm

Just add my 20 cents worth. I have instances in the past from servos fuel pumps where the diesel had a petrol smell about it. Looks like diesel and has a petrol smell to it.
Sometimes there is some contamination during delivery, ie the wrong tanker hose is used or it is not cleaned out properly before the diesel is pumped through it into the below ground tank. Small quantities I know, and it probably wouldn't effect the diesel engine, however if the service station decides to change one of the bulk tanks from petrol to diesel and the tank is not empty of petrol first before filling with diesel then it is a problem. Or there may be contamination issues on the delivery tanker.

I had a friend ask me to check some diesel that he brought at a servo last week, he had a jerry can full, it looked like diesel and smelt like petrol, his Nissan had a half a tank full of it and was running rough at idle.
So yes, **** happens, call it human error or carelessness and I suspect that this may have been the case in this event.
Of course when you go back with the evidence and check the pump there is no contamination because the tank has been filled several times since and now is pure diesel.
It does happen and it has happened to me.

On a technical basis a diesel will run on petrol if its timing is retarded enough so that detonation is not prior to TDC, I know of one that ran on petrol for several weeks. (not mine) and I would not recommend it to anyone either,

Matt

__________________
Biodiesel Bandit

Landcruiser 98 B100 (100,000km and still going)
Peugeot 306 xtdt B100
Peugeot 2004 2L 307 HDI Does not like B100