Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

[mulgunnia Biofuels Forum Newbie Find all posts View Profile Close mulgunnia]

Hi,

We want to use bio-diesel in our tractor (new model new holland) and '92 hilux surf 2.4. Can anyone see an issue here?

Also, we would want to store in an overhead tank. Can anyone see any issues with this? The tank is in Bathurst so it does snow from time to time and we get heavy frosts in winter.

I have herd adding Kero to the fuel helps in winter...

Thanks!
David

[Tony From West Oz Vice Chairperson of WARFA Find all posts View Profile Close Tony From West Oz]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

David,
Congratulations on choosing to use biodiesel in your tractor and ute.
Are you making the biodiesel yourself? If so, you know the source oil and it is easy to predict the oils which will give high melting point biodiesel. Tallow and Palm oil will convert to biodiesel which has a melting point around 10 - 15 °C
A useful test is to take a sample of the fuel and put it in the fridge (nominally 5°C) and see if it solidifies. If it stays liquid, try it in the deep freezer (nominally -5°C) and see if it solidifies at that temperature. Biodiesel, which is liquid at the lowest storage temperature you expect, should be fine in your Overhead Storage tank.

There should be no problems with using biodiesel in the diesel engines you have. Be aware of the "cleansing effect" of biodiesel which will kill off the microbes in the fuel tanks and release the sludge into your fuel filter. Ensure that you have a supply of fuel filters during the first few tankfulls of biodiesel in these vehicles.
I recommend adding a "disposable fuel filter" (cheap Chinese one - $2.00 at Cheap Auto Parts) before the main fuel filter in each vehicle to catch the sludge before it clogs your expensive stock fuel filter. These are easy to fit and to replace when they clog. After the sludge has passed thru I have left the added filter (a new clean one) on the vehicle, as a precaution.

[mulgunnia Biofuels Forum Newbie Find all posts View Profile Close mulgunnia]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

David,
Congratulations on choosing to use biodiesel in your tractor and ute.
Are you making the biodiesel yourself? If so, you know the source oil and it is easy to predict the oils which will give high melting point biodiesel. Tallow and Palm oil will convert to biodiesel which has a melting point around 10 - 15 °C

I havent sourced the oil yet, thats the next challenge. Do you know of any places you can buy tallow/palm in bulk? (1000ltrs a shipment)

I have been looking around on the net at the waste oil recylers like Auscol. Anyone had any experience here?

[Terry Syd Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Terry Syd]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

Be careful about the grade of WVO you purchase from one of the WVO dealers. You can get some very high FFA oil that will give you a very low yield of biodiesel. You might want to do a titration of the oil at the plant before you decide to purchase. See whether the purchase will be cost effective.

Some plants have different grades. They may take off the lighter vegetable oil with the low FFA and sell that at a premium. They may offer you some high fat, high FFA oil that is more difficult to sell - and to convert to usable biodiesel.

[mulgunnia Biofuels Forum Newbie Find all posts View Profile Close mulgunnia]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

Be careful about the grade of WVO you purchase from one of the WVO dealers. You can get some very high FFA oil that will give you a very low yield of biodiesel. You might want to do a titration of the oil at the plant before you decide to purchase. See whether the purchase will be cost effective.

Thanks Terry, I was wondering about that. Ascol offer "no more than 5% ffa" oil. No idea on price as yet. Is that still to much?

Is tallow or vegie oil better in cold climates?

In winter would we be better off running B80?

[Gunner Donating Member Find all posts View Profile Close Gunner]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

Is tallow or vegie oil better in cold climates?

In winter would we be better off running B80?

Vegie oil is definately better in colder months than Tallow, but is still not trouble-free. The commercial that the Rutherford plant was selling back in Dec-Jan had a proportion of Tallow in the mix. How do I know this? Once the colder weather hit Lithgow (We were getting several nights of -5, -6 etc and daytime temps rarely got above 10 deg!), the Tallow-based BD would solidify and precipitate out of the Vegie based BD. The Tallow-BD would form a solid waxy base about 4 inches in the bottom of a 44gal drum. Surprisingly, the Vegie-based BD in the same drum did not go cloudy. As the drum was exposed to a cold night or two, fine waxy "Sago" would be floating in the BD. This was quite simple to filter out of the liquid BD with a mesh strainer. In the sun, this wax would re-melt back to a perfectly good fuel. However, I have thought it prudent to keep all of this heavier BD in a separate container to use in Summertime.
After a prolonged cold snap, this fine waxy stuff would accumulate into the solid layer on the bottom of the drum. It is thick enough to plug the pick-up tube of the drum pump. I haven't been able to break this layer up sufficiently to get the chunks out of the 2" opening. Noticeably though, at this stage the Vegie-based BD has become cloudy with a scum layer on the surface. Just decanting the cloudy Vegie-BD into a black plastic jerry can and leaving it to soak up heat in the sun will return it to a clear, free-flowing liquid fuel. After starting the car on Petro-Diesel until the car comes to operating temp then changing over tanks, I am running on 100% Vegie-BD currently with no problems at all, although I am accumulating a lot of waxy blocks of Tallow-BD waiting for Summer!

[AngusF Member Find all posts View Profile Close AngusF]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

Sorry to drag this posting out off the mothballs, but Im interested to hear from anyone that has practical experience with using blends or BD in tractors. I have just bought a farm and with it, a Fiat 513R tractor. I run my 75series LC ute on wvo and wondering if I can do something with BD and oil for the tractor.

I would prefer to hear postings from people that do it, or have done it in tractors, not so much theories.

Cheers
Angus

[Westwinds Donating Member Find all posts View Profile Close Westwinds]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

Gday,I use b100 in a Chamberlain C670 and i have not any problems useing bio considering i may have the tractor in the shed for a couple of months and not use it.when i do use the tractor it starts up straight away.I do have a clear supercheap filter before the main filters.Also i believe it is difficult to get WVO from cafes,pubs etc in the Orange Bathurst areas,however there is a guy that does collect and if you track him down he may sell WVO to you.I am not 100 percent sure but i think he was the guy that i upset getting oil from a cafe in Parkes and getting a visit from the dept of Primary Industries wanting to know what i did with the oil.The DPI was concerned that i was'nt feeding livestock WVO in feed.regards westwinds

[AngusF Member Find all posts View Profile Close AngusF]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

Thanks for that Westwinds. I have arrangements with some oil users here in Sthn NSW so supply of WVO is not a problem. I buy BD from Volume Plus in Ingleburn when I drive to Sydney. Its nice and close to the M5 and only takes 15 minutes out of my trip and its competatively priced.

I think I will wait until summer before trying anything with the tractor, and then will slowly blend some bio with regular diesel and work my way along from there.
Thanks for the info.

Cheers

[AngusF Member Find all posts View Profile Close AngusF]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

Dave,
for me to divert and battle the traffic and conditions to get into Marrikville would more than likely negate the use of biodiesel in the first place. To save money and lower exhaust emissions. Im not concerned whether VP is in it for a quick buck or not. I use BD for the right reasons and if Im burning more fuel to get to a station that provides the same or similar product then its pointless really.

Unless you can show me evidence that VP is using Palm Oil that has been cultivated at the expense of old growth or rainforest, or some other diabolical practise, then I will continue to lower my exhaust emissions by filling from them at Ingelburn rather than burning more fuel to get to Morris at Marrikville.

But I appreciate your concern, and if I lived closer, I would use use Morris.

Cheers

[E Tolle Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close E Tolle]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

Hmmmmm.........Bio Diesel in tractors eh !!!!!

This guy tried it and look what happened

TRACTOR BANG - YouTube - Truveo Video Search

[AngusF Member Find all posts View Profile Close AngusF]

Re: Biodiesel in tractors and storing in overhead tanks

Very amusing.