Make Biodiesel with Ethanol

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Hi Folk, i have a question to make Biofuel with ethanol instead of Methanol. Before the question is coming why ethanol. I am from Austria. I try to register in a forum in UK but it failed. So i found with google your forum. In Austria itīs forbidden to sell Methanol to private. Unless you have a business where methanol is required. I can only buy 1 l bottles in Chemical Labor Shops . Price 7€/l. Denatured ethanol is possible to buy. I hope i find a way to buy methanol in hungary. Rumors tell the hungary sellers dont ask if you have a business or not.

Ok, now my questions.
Is the process same like with methanol ?
If no where is the different. Can you tell me or write the link to a side who explain it.

Bernhard

PS: Sorry for my english, i am out of exercise to write in english

[Andy Chee Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Andy Chee]

Yes, it is possible to use ethanol.

The main difference is that more ethanol is required for the transesterification reaction. Also pure ethanol recovery is more complicated, because ethanol will combine with water and form an azeotrope. You will need to use a desiccant like Calcium Oxide to remove water from the recovered ethanol.

Here is a paper:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...10062115000914

Andy Chee

[tillyfromparadise Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close tillyfromparadise]

Hi Bernhard, welcome to the forum,
I remember years ago that people trying to use ethanol had very minimal success. They found that even though on occasion there appeared to have been a reaction occur, there would not be separation- the glycerine would not settle out . I think the likely reason for this is that while biodiesel and methanol are virtually immisable, ethanol and biodiesel are misable, at least to a certain degree. So possibly heating the results of the reaction to drive off the remaining ethanol would result in the glycerine layer dropping out because glycerol and biodiesel are not mixcable.
Also they needed to be much more careful to remove as much water as possible before performing the reaction. In the 20+ years I have been actively involved in these discussion forums and making biodiesel, I do not recall any backyard biodiesel producer having successfully made biodiesel from ethanol. I can not even recall anyone being successful making small experimental batches with ethanol.
A long time ago there was a fellow on another forum that has since disappeared who mix the ethoxide with veg oil that did not result in separation but did produce a mixture with reduced viscosity. He then successfully used that to fuel his diesel. Whether there was a reaction or not ??? Just adding ethanol to veg oil will reduce its viscosity.
Over the years, WesleyB, a poster to this forum has made a number of small experimental batches of biodiesel using various chemicals. He does not actually use biodiesel but seems to enjoy doing experiments. You might try and contact him and ask whether he has used ethanol and what he has found.

[tillyfromparadise Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close tillyfromparadise]

Hi Bernhard, welcome to the forum,
I remember years ago that people trying to use ethanol had very minimal success. They found that even though on occasion there appeared to have been a reaction occur, there would not be separation- the glycerine would not settle out . I think the likely reason for this is that while biodiesel and methanol are virtually immisable, ethanol and biodiesel are misable, at least to a certain degree. So possibly heating the results of the reaction to drive off the remaining ethanol would result in the glycerine layer dropping out because glycerol and biodiesel are not mixcable.
Also they needed to be much more careful to remove as much water as possible before performing the reaction. In the 20+ years I have been actively involved in these discussion forums and making biodiesel, I do not recall any backyard biodiesel producer having successfully made biodiesel from ethanol. I can not even recall anyone being successful making small experimental batches with ethanol.
A long time ago there was a fellow on another forum that has since disappeared who mix the ethoxide with veg oil that did not result in separation but did produce a mixture with reduced viscosity. He then successfully used that to fuel his diesel. Whether there was a reaction or not ??? Just adding ethanol to veg oil will reduce its viscosity.
Over the years, WesleyB, a poster to this forum has made a number of small experimental batches of biodiesel using various chemicals. He does not actually use biodiesel but seems to enjoy doing experiments. You might try and contact him and ask whether he has used ethanol and what he has found.

[tillyfromparadise Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close tillyfromparadise]

Hi Bernhard, welcome to the forum,
I remember years ago that people trying to use ethanol had very minimal success. They found that even though on occasion there appeared to have been a reaction occur, there would not be separation- the glycerine would not settle out . I think the likely reason for this is that while biodiesel and methanol are virtually immisable, ethanol and biodiesel are misable, at least to a certain degree. So possibly heating the results of the reaction to drive off the remaining ethanol would result in the glycerine layer dropping out because glycerol and biodiesel are not mixcable.
Also they needed to be much more careful to remove as much water as possible before performing the reaction. In the 20+ years I have been actively involved in these discussion forums and making biodiesel, I do not recall any backyard biodiesel producer having successfully made biodiesel from ethanol. I can not even recall anyone being successful making small experimental batches with ethanol.
A long time ago there was a fellow on another forum that has since disappeared who mix the ethoxide with veg oil that did not result in separation but did produce a mixture with reduced viscosity. He then successfully used that to fuel his diesel. Whether there was a reaction or not ??? Just adding ethanol to veg oil will reduce its viscosity.
Over the years, WesleyB, a poster to this forum has made a number of small experimental batches of biodiesel using various chemicals. He does not actually use biodiesel but seems to enjoy doing experiments. You might try and contact him and ask whether he has used ethanol and what he has found.

[tillyfromparadise Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close tillyfromparadise]

Hi Bernhard, welcome to the forum,
I remember years ago that people trying to use ethanol had very minimal success. They found that even though on occasion there appeared to have been a reaction occur, there would not be separation- the glycerine would not settle out . I think the likely reason for this is that while biodiesel and methanol are virtually immisable, ethanol and biodiesel are misable, at least to a certain degree. So possibly heating the results of the reaction to drive off the remaining ethanol would result in the glycerine layer dropping out because glycerol and biodiesel are not mixcable.
Also they needed to be much more careful to remove as much water as possible before performing the reaction. In the 20+ years I have been actively involved in these discussion forums and making biodiesel, I do not recall any backyard biodiesel producer having successfully made biodiesel from ethanol. I can not even recall anyone being successful making small experimental batches with ethanol.
A long time ago there was a fellow on another forum that has since disappeared who mix the ethoxide with veg oil that did not result in separation but did produce a mixture with reduced viscosity. He then successfully used that to fuel his diesel. Whether there was a reaction or not ??? Just adding ethanol to veg oil will reduce its viscosity.
Over the years, WesleyB, a poster to this forum has made a number of small experimental batches of biodiesel using various chemicals. He does not actually use biodiesel but seems to enjoy doing experiments. You might try and contact him and ask whether he has used ethanol and what he has found.

[tillyfromparadise Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close tillyfromparadise]

Hi Bernhard, welcome to the forum,
I remember years ago that people trying to use ethanol had very minimal success. They found that even though on occasion there appeared to have been a reaction occur, there would not be separation- the glycerine would not settle out . I think the likely reason for this is that while biodiesel and methanol are virtually immisable, ethanol and biodiesel are misable, at least to a certain degree. So possibly heating the results of the reaction to drive off the remaining ethanol would result in the glycerine layer dropping out because glycerol and biodiesel are not mixcable.
Also they needed to be much more careful to remove as much water as possible before performing the reaction. In the 20+ years I have been actively involved in these discussion forums and making biodiesel, I do not recall any backyard biodiesel producer having successfully made biodiesel from ethanol. I can not even recall anyone being successful making small experimental batches with ethanol.
A long time ago there was a fellow on another forum that has since disappeared who mix the ethoxide with veg oil that did not result in separation but did produce a mixture with reduced viscosity. He then successfully used that to fuel his diesel. Whether there was a reaction or not ??? Just adding ethanol to veg oil will reduce its viscosity.
Over the years, WesleyB, a poster to this forum has made a number of small experimental batches of biodiesel using various chemicals. He does not actually use biodiesel but seems to enjoy doing experiments. You might try and contact him and ask whether he has used ethanol and what he has found.

[CMM Biofuels Forum Newbie Find all posts View Profile Close CMM]

Hola Tilly:
long time w/o any talking with you.
At Brazil, they produce ethylesters by using ethanol from sugar cane. Of course BD washing is mandatory.
As per my memory, they use "For making biodiesel with dried ethanol, the recommended catalyst is 99% potasyum hydroxide .
It is used 9 g/L minimum and 18 g/L maximum , calculated by titration , over the volume of vegetable oil to process."

Best regards

CARLOS

[WesleyB Donating Member Find all posts View Profile Close WesleyB]

I made biodiesel using 99% anhydrous ethanol . It reacts normally like methanol , and formed a glycerine layer . With 95% ethanol/5% water , I got no reaction . To make ethyl biodiesel it has to be very dry . I would have to calculate the volume of ethanol to use . It is greater volume than when using methanol . Do not water wash ethyl biodiesel , dry wash it .

[WesleyB Donating Member Find all posts View Profile Close WesleyB]

If you use 20% methanol per litre of vegetable oil to make biodiesel , you need to use 288 millilitres of dry (anhydrous) ethanol per litre of vegetable oil to make the ethyl biodiesel . Methanol is 32 grams per mole . Ethanol is 46 grams per mole . The demsity of methanol is 0.792 grams per milliliter . The density of anhydrous ethanol is 0.78945 grams per milliliter .

[WesleyB Donating Member Find all posts View Profile Close WesleyB]

If you can't buy 200 proof , 100% anhydrous , industrial ethanol , you can make it . But check the laws in your area first . In Texas an industrial distiller's state issued license is required to make 200 proof ethanol . Put enough Calcium Oxide in a still pot to adsorb the water from the 190 proof grain alcohol . Heat in a sealed container , over night . Distill off the anhydrous ethanol . Package the dry (anhydrous) ethanol in a sealed container . It will absorb water from the air . In this way you can make 99% + anhydrous ethanol to make synthetic ethyl biodiesel fuel . After removing the glycerine layer , boil off excess ethanol in a vacuum still if you have one . Anhydrous ethanol is hydrophillic , it sucks water vapor from the air . I expect there are problems with ethyl biodiesel , fatty acid ethyl esters , that don't exist with methyl biodiesel . After distilling off excess alcohol , more glycerine will fall out .