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  • Biodiesel Supplies

    Please read this thread before posting here!


    Can anyone recommend where to buy some of the essentials for making your own biodiesel from used cooking oil?

    For example:
    • Drums
    • Filters
    • Methanol/Ethanol
    • KOH
    Thanks.
    Robert
    Administrator
    Last edited by Robert; 23 October 2005, 12:56 PM.
    Robert.
    Site Admin.

  • #2
    In West OZ, a chemical company "David Gray" imports the bulk chemicals in blue 205 litre HDPE drums. These make excellent storage vessels and can be used for washing / drying tanks too. They were $5.00 each a couple of years ago.

    Australian Filter Specialists sell bag filters in either nylon mesh (too expensive for me) or polyester felt (good price), in a variety of micron ratings. They are approx 200 mm diameter and approx 450mm long. These were $9.00 each at my last visit. They can be washed out in biodiesel byproduct and re-used many times. I have a couple which were my original ones, filtering Used Cooking Oil to 5 micron, from 2000. I doubt their micron rating could be quantified at this time, and the metal ring in the top has broken. I use these to show others how robust they are.
    They will fit in the top of a home brew drum and the bung in the side can be used to attach a tap/hose to fill your "filtered oil" containers. These filters are fine to 100C.
    Tony From West Oz
    Vice Chairperson of WARFA
    Last edited by Tony From West Oz; 21 September 2005, 02:22 AM.
    Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

    Current Vehicles in stable:
    '06 Musso Sports 4X4 Manual Crew Cab tray back.
    '04 Rexton 4X4 Automatic SUV
    '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP) - Wife's car

    Previous Vehicles:
    '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup.
    '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
    '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Engine donor for W123 coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
    '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel
    '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
    '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
    '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab well body. [Head gasket blew!]
    '04 Rexton SUV 2.9L Turbodiesel same as Musso - Our Family car.
    '06 Musso sports Crew Cab Trayback - My hack (no air cond, no heater).

    Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
    Adding images and/or documents to your posts

    Comment


    • #3
      Methanol can be bought from Whitey's (9897 3148) at Merrylands, currently $1.30/L or $205 for a 200L drum.

      KOH (flake) from Kleenco at Bankstown 9707 3333, $60 for a 25Kg bag.
      Kleenco also sell their empty 200L plastic barrels for around $10 each I think.

      Plastic drums of all sizes can usually be found at the Sunday markets at Leppington Bazaar, ranging from $3 to $20 depending on size & condition.

      Hope this helps anyone starting out. I know it took me a bit of legwork to get going.

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks, keep 'em coming

        Thanks Tony & geewizztoo. Very helpful info, especially for those of us who need to know where to start. I particularly like the idea of buying empty used plastic barrels and containers from markets, all the more recycling gets done that way!

        Any more posts here would be welcome.
        Robert.
        Site Admin.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Biodiesel Supplies

          Hi, I just joined this group and I am in north Brisbane. I am setting up to make my own biodiesel and I found a source of free 20 ltr drums.
          Printing plants use a large amount of plate processor chemicals and these are usually delivered in translucent 20 ltr drums which are thrown away when empty. The Kodak ones have the facility to insert a tap at the bottom if needed. I am sure if you were to ask at any printing plant they might give you the drums. I also noticed that they use large amounts of isoprpyl alcohol and these are delivered in 200ltr steel drums but I have yet to find out if these are also available.
          Hope this helps
          Peter.


          Nissan Patrol 4.2 Td

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Biodiesel Supplies

            These 20 or 25 litre chemical drums are very useful. They can be a beginners biodiesel processor, and when you upscale, use them as a methoxide mixer.
            I believe these are similar to what those in the USA refer to a "cubies".

            You may also like to look at hme brew beer kits. The brew fermenter is larger (30 - 40 litres?) and has a larger lid. The smaller opening in this lid has a screw on cap with a grommeted hole (gas seal location) which can be used to seal against a stirrer, if an electric drill is used to agitate the process, minimising methanol loss to atmosphere.

            You may also like to investigate dog food drums or pool chlorine drums.
            Life is a journey, with problems to solve, lessons to learn, but most of all, experiences to enjoy.

            Current Vehicles in stable:
            '06 Musso Sports 4X4 Manual Crew Cab tray back.
            '04 Rexton 4X4 Automatic SUV
            '2014 Toyota Prius (on ULP) - Wife's car

            Previous Vehicles:
            '90 Mazda Capella. (2000 - 2003) My first Fatmobile. Converted to fun on veggie oil with a 2 tank setup.
            '80 Mercedes 300D. 2 tank conversion [Sold]
            '84 Mercedes 300D. 1 tank, no conversion. Replaced engine with rebuilt OM617A turbodiesel engine. Finally had good power. Engine donor for W123 coupe. (body parted out and carcass sold for scrap.)
            '85 Mercedes Benz W123 300CD Turbodiesel
            '99 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my darling Wife's car)[sold]
            '98 Mercedes W202 C250 Turbodiesel (my car)[sold]
            '06 Musso Sports Crew Cab well body. [Head gasket blew!]
            '04 Rexton SUV 2.9L Turbodiesel same as Musso - Our Family car.
            '06 Musso sports Crew Cab Trayback - My hack (no air cond, no heater).

            Searching the Biofuels Forum using Google
            Adding images and/or documents to your posts

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Biodiesel Supplies

              Hi Peda,

              Good to hear someone is so close to Home. I'm up the sunshine coast and travel through Brissy every month or so.

              I have a few localised questions:
              Where do you get lye (what do we call it in Australia).
              Where do you get methynol from.
              What sort of Oil do you use, clean or used.
              What do you do with the glycerine.
              I guess you dont have a problem with winter blends.


              Joe
              Joe Morgan
              Brisbane Biodiesel Site Admin
              http://www.brisbanebiodiesel.com

              Searching tips using Google - SVO Dual tank systems
              SVO, Common Rail and Direct Injection - Vehicles converted to Used Cooking Oil

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Biodiesel Supplies

                Hi Joe, welcome, so far I am in the research and set up stage so haven't made any yet, time is a killer for me at the moment, but it will happen!!
                to answer some of your questions..

                Where do you get lye (what do we call it in Australia).
                -i have been doing a lot of research on the net for about 5 months now and Lye can be NaOh which is caustic soda sometimes sold as drain cleaner in hw shops apparently, or it can be KOH , potassium hydroxide. The use of these require different amounts to be added so you have to use the right method in relation to which chemical you use. So far I have found a supplier in Brisbane , Ajax Chemicals 07 38599455 and sell 25kg bags of both for about $6 kg plus gst. That is a lot of chemical and I am not sure if I want to buy that much first up until I have this process mastered.

                Where do you get methynol from.
                Here I am lucky as I have been using methanol for years in my model aeroplane engines. It can usually be baught from model aeroplane hobby shops and they will fill your container for about a dollar, maybe more per litre. It can also be supplied in the big bulk 200ltr drums from racing fuel suppliers.
                See my posting regarding a source of 20 ltr drums. If you want I can give you some.

                What sort of Oil do you use, clean or used.
                I plan to use waste cooking oil and am yet to pluck up the courage to approach the local asian restaurants. I beleive that the oil they use is still liquid at room temp which would be easier to handle I would think, rather than the deep fry stuff from fish and chip shops which goes hard when cold. However since you need to heat the oil during the mixing process this is probably not a deterent from using it but I would like to filter it before starting the process and I just think if that can be done with a cold product it would safer to handle plus if left to sit for a while any water would settle out.

                What do you do with the glycerine.
                Don't know yet havent made any. I read though that if you use caustic soda for the lye then the glycerine is slightly toxic, whereas if you use potassium hydroxide the glycerine is more environmentally friendly and safe to use in the garden or compost. There are other uses for the glycerine such as a degreaser for engines and hand cleaner but you have to distill out any residual methanol before use.

                I guess you dont have a problem with winter blends.
                Not expecting to, nor should you if you live north of me.

                If any of my comments here are wrong could someone please correct me as I am by no means anything other than an enthusiastic beginner and i would rather be corrected now.

                Regards
                Peter

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Biodiesel Supplies

                  Hi Peda,

                  thanks for your comments.

                  Prehaps if some of the initial costs are a bit difficult to justify (25kgs of Sodium Hydroxide) prehaps we could consider getting some interested parties together and all going in for the stuff. Or maybe there is someone local who is reading this who may have smaller saleable quantities.

                  So how big are you considering starting? 20 - 50 ltrs?

                  Cheers
                  Joe
                  Joe Morgan
                  Brisbane Biodiesel Site Admin
                  http://www.brisbanebiodiesel.com

                  Searching tips using Google - SVO Dual tank systems
                  SVO, Common Rail and Direct Injection - Vehicles converted to Used Cooking Oil

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Biodiesel Supplies

                    Hi Peda & Joe,

                    I've just widened the scope of these forums to include the whole of Australia, rather than just Sydney. I've set up a Brisbane area for you (and any other Queenslanders), so if you wanted to continue this discussion, you've now got a proper home for it. I've also cut & pasted some of your info from here into there.

                    Cheers,
                    Robert.
                    Site Admin.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Biodiesel Supplies

                      Nice response and well timed.

                      Joe
                      Joe Morgan
                      Brisbane Biodiesel Site Admin
                      http://www.brisbanebiodiesel.com

                      Searching tips using Google - SVO Dual tank systems
                      SVO, Common Rail and Direct Injection - Vehicles converted to Used Cooking Oil

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Biodiesel Supplies

                        Thanks robert, this is getting exciting!!!!!
                        Peter

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Biodiesel Supplies

                          Originally posted by Peda

                          Where do you get methynol from.
                          Here I am lucky as I have been using methanol for years in my model aeroplane engines. It can usually be baught from model aeroplane hobby shops and they will fill your container for about a dollar, maybe more per litre. It can also be supplied in the big bulk 200ltr drums from racing fuel suppliers.
                          See my posting regarding a source of 20 ltr drums. If you want I can give you some.
                          Peda,

                          I have rung a few hobby shops and I'm a little confused about what "methonol" is. All of the instructions that have been listed to make biodiesel say methonol, but when talking to hobby shop owners they ask if I want "Methonol, or methonol fuel". Then to make is even more confusing, there is 60% fuel (for cars) and 80% (for planes) and straight methonol.

                          So I know that the instructions at web sites say 95% or better methonol, but you say above that you'll use aeroplane methonol.

                          Straight methonol fuel is $5 a litre for a 5 litle bottle. Is that expensive?

                          I assume the the additives such as nitro and castor oil would make the process of conversion not as clean or worse yet, leave some undesireable additives in the fuel.

                          Joe
                          Joe Morgan
                          Brisbane Biodiesel Site Admin
                          http://www.brisbanebiodiesel.com

                          Searching tips using Google - SVO Dual tank systems
                          SVO, Common Rail and Direct Injection - Vehicles converted to Used Cooking Oil

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Biodiesel Supplies

                            Hi Joe, I see your recent posting re supplies on the sunshine coast so that is good. The cost of the chemical is far cheaper than the quote I got at about $6 kg, so well done. Is that for flake potassium ?
                            Re methanol you need just pure methanol. The hobby shops talk about percentages when they mix methanol with a % of nitromethane and either castor oil or synthetic oil. This is a two stroke fuel like in the lawn mower. I mix my own fuel hence I buy the straight methanol from a local for $26 for 20 ltrs. Some hobby shops sell the methanol bulk for people to mix their own fuel but not all shops are set up to do that, hence you have to ask around.
                            I have found that www.rsaustralia.com have the 98% isopropanol for titration, part number227-4427 about $23 for a litre and you can buy online and they will deliver it.
                            Peter

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Biodiesel Supplies

                              Hi Peter,

                              Yeah I finally took the plunge and did the ring around. Was told an aweful story by a mechanic about a guy "that I should have talked to" if I had of rung 5 minutes earlier. He said one of his customers was up from Brisbane and that he made, used his own biodiesel. I was spewing because I had mucked around for ages trying to find the numbers of businesses that sold methonol. So I finally get this guy that has had a biodiesel guru there all morning. (Well maybe he wasn't a guru it would have been interesting to talk to him.)

                              Yeah I think I listed both prices. One which is sodium based and another that is Potassium based.

                              Thanks for the tips with Methonol. I kind of knew that if you put impurities in the biodiesel, its either got to be removed of it would go into the combustion area.

                              BUying for $26 for 20 dollars is unbelievable. I'll be down on Saturday, if you could tell me where to go get it I could grab some. We could go halves in a bag of NaOH or KOH. I could do a run on Saturday morning.

                              You said you might have some drums to give away, is that still a valid offer?

                              Cheers
                              Joe
                              Joe Morgan
                              Brisbane Biodiesel Site Admin
                              http://www.brisbanebiodiesel.com

                              Searching tips using Google - SVO Dual tank systems
                              SVO, Common Rail and Direct Injection - Vehicles converted to Used Cooking Oil

                              Comment

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