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  • SVO upflow design with photos!

    I'm thinking of making an upflow system for settling my WVO to reduce the amount of filtering I do, and this is the basic design I've come up with so far which I would like some input on:


    With my consumption rate the oil would be settling for about 6 weeks on average.

    I'm not intending to filter the fat out before the upflow tank, as I would just periodically drain it out the bottom once it's settled. I can't see the point of using the Woolies bags, as that is what I currently use (in conjunction with a 5u bag filter) without the upflow tank.

    The main reason I want to use 2 tanks welded together instead of side by side like some others have done is to save space in my shed.

    For the pump I need something with a slow flow rate so not to disturb the oil in the upflow tank, but strong enough to push against the oil when it's full to the top.

    I know some people use a submersible bilge pumps, but I want to have an inline one as per the diagram. Would a drill powered pump (like this) running slowly do the job? Or maybe a centrifugal pump with a restriction on the inlet to keep the flow rate down? Or how about a 12V caravan/boat type pump?
    pangit
    Moderator
    Last edited by pangit; 12 November 2009, 01:20 AM.
    Sean

  • #2
    Re: Critique my upflow design

    Sean, Nice artwork !

    This is similar to mine, but i do use the Bunnings bag - (basically a water tank screen on top to catch the crunchies), then into the woolies bag - i usually stop pouring from the drums when the thick white oil shows up.

    I can put about 40 litres into a Bunnings bag then head off to work and most of the time it has filtered through by the time i get through.

    I actually have 2 x 220 litre poly drums - it takes roughly 1 week to fill one and then i let it settle for another week. I have a drain at the bottom and drain off about 10 litres of crap.

    (My house is on a sloping block so i let gravity do the next part for me but your pump could do the same), i have an outlet about 6 inches from the bottom of the poly drums connected to 13mm poly irrigation pipe.

    It runs down through here into the bottom of another 220l poly drum and upflows to the top and then into a 44Gallon drum with 3 x 5 micron filters in the top

    I get about 600 litres through a 5 micron bag filter before they start to slow down - so the upflow seems to work well.

    You might want some form of bypass for the 5 micron bag in case it backs up and overflows ? Maybe clamp it around 6 inch PVC pipe (hose clamps) then have an outlet towards the top of the PVC pipe that goes back to your settling tank

    Craig
    Holden Suburban K2500 1998 6.5L Turbo GM engine
    210,000KMs (90,000 on new crate motor)

    Currently 2 tanks in and working - 90 litre BIO tank and main tank of 160L WVO

    30 plate FPHE in Engine bay and Helton Dual coil in rear
    Walbro FRB-5 pusher pumps x 2

    50,000KM on Veg and 10,000Km on B100

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Critique my upflow design

      pangit

      Yeah it is good artwork! Incidently what program/s did you use for that?

      No doubt you realize that if you mount the collecting tank at or above the outlet of the settler tank, then you wouldn't need the pump or check valve. Only a regular valve would be required. Pros and cons here I guess.

      I suggest making the drain valves of a generous size if you are putting fats in.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Critique my upflow design

        I would also raise the outlet going to the car from the drying/storage tank, so as the fat etc settles in the bottom and not go into your vehicle and clog your 1um filter.
        TroopyHZJ75

        225,000km on WVO and counting
        1991 HZJ75 Landcruiser Troopy
        Two Tank System- 90ltr Dino / 140ltr WVO
        30 plate HE
        CAV filter
        20 plate HE
        2 x 6 way pollack valves (one for delayed purge changeover)

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Critique my upflow design

          Gday Pangit,I have 3 comments about your design.

          1. It is good practise to restrict the discharge on a centrifugal pump rather than the suction as it can cause cavatation where the impellar vibrates against the outer houseing.

          2.With your vent i suggest that you have a pipe on it going outside incase you overfill tank and oil goes over your garage floor.Not a pretty sight.

          3.With your 2 44s welded together if you decide to have a sight tube, go for 3/4 clear plastic pipe as the fats tend to not move up the tube as well with 1/2 inch and can give you a false indication on how full your tank is.

          regards westwinds.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Critique my upflow design

            I was using a 200Litre upflow tank for a while and using only the top half of long (months) settled drums, then settling for 2 weeks or more, then into a 5 micron bag and it was immediately clogging the bag with fat. So I stopped going straight to the 5 micron and went to the woolies bag first instead. Lots of fat stopped in the woolies bag so I stopped using the upflow and went back to the old system of:
            Long settling in 20litre drums, pour till fat appears into woolies bag, tap off 2" above bottom and pour into 5 micron bag, tap off 2" above bottom into storage containers, pump through 1 micron cartridge into vehicle tank.

            I can process about 300 litres/week without actually setting aside any time to do it, just doing some transfers whenever passing. Say 10 - 15 minutes total/day.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Critique my upflow design

              Sean,

              Looks very nice mate.

              Make sure the 1 micron out let is fitted with long enough hose to reach my car too "you know where I live hey?".

              Thanks mate
              Fitian
              <><

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Critique my upflow design

                Sean, I've not seen those pumps before, but as they say they pump motor oil then they should be able to pump WVO. I'd use a battery drill to start off with to see what the flow is and add the electric drill later if needed. Something with a variable speed control would be nice so you don't overload the drill by trying to pump oil at high volume.

                Also think about joining the drums via their bottoms so you have fittings already built in at the top and bottom. The 50mm at the bottom could be the yucky drain.

                I have a four stage upflow system which is supposed to total 800 litres, but I lose a bit of capacity as the drums are angled and lying down. I agree an upright system could save space. There are times when I run out of oil to pump INTO the system but I need oil OUT for longer trips etc. Rather than take oil from the bottom, I can take it from any of the other drums as the fittings are accessible.

                Maybe you could weld a bung/tap at a sensible point half way up so you could drain your top drum and still get pretty reasonable oil.

                I agree with the sight glass and hose on overflow suggestions

                Tim
                Toyota Landcruiser 1988 HJ61 Manual Wagon
                12H-T turbo Direct Injection.
                Twin Tank setup runs on 100% WVO after warm up. 30 plate FPHE with 80C output, 12mm fuel lines
                Start up and shut down electric fuel pump feeds IP direct.
                Front 4WDSytstems Lokka, Rear ARB airlokka for quick escapes up sandhills. Performance GTurbo with 600mm FMIC gives 450nm @ 1700rpm at 20psi boost.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Critique my upflow design

                  Some good tips guys, thanks. Particularly about the sight tube and middle drain valve. I'll definitely incorporate those.

                  Craig - why do you use the Bunnings/Woolies bags and an upflow tank? I am currently using them without upflow and it produces nice clean oil, but I have the hassles of scraping the fats out of the bags, and the very slow filtering process.

                  I'm trying to avoid that by using upflow settling to let the fats sink to the bottom where I can simply drain them off. Then I'm hoping the oil coming out of the top is good enough to go through the 5u filter bags without clogging them up. Am I missing something?

                  You might want some form of bypass for the 5 micron bag in case it backs up and overflows ?
                  Yes I might have a small holding tank for the outlet of the upflow tank, which then can be drained into the filters in a controlled way. Alternatively if I mount the upflow outlet a few inches below the top I can keep the valve off until it fills up (hence the vent), then switch the inlet pump off and crack open the valve a bit to drain into the filters slowly.
                  Yeah it is good artwork! Incidently what program/s did you use for that?
                  Thanks, I just knocked it together quickly in Fireworks as that is what I have on my PC.

                  No doubt you realize that if you mount the collecting tank at or above the outlet of the settler tank, then you wouldn't need the pump or check valve
                  Yes I've thought of that but I would have to mount the collecting tank about 3m in the air! I want to keep it as low as possible to make it easier to fill.

                  I was using a 200Litre upflow tank for a while and using only the top half of long (months) settled drums, then settling for 2 weeks or more, then into a 5 micron bag and it was immediately clogging the bag with fat.
                  Yes I remember you mentioning that Paul, although I've not heard of anyone else having that experience. Was your tank exposed to direct sunlight at all? If so the sun would have heated one side of the tank which could have caused convection currents. Mine will be inside the shed to avoid that. I was also thinking of mounting a horizontal baffle just above the inlet to reduce mixing. Not sure if it's necessary though.

                  Any more thoughts about pumps? I guess I'll try a drill pump and see how it goes. At least it will be easy to adjust the speed to experiment with. If it works ultimately I'd like to incorporate a float switch to turn itself off when it fills up the upflow tank. The 50mm outlet at the top would be ideal for that.
                  pangit
                  Moderator
                  Last edited by pangit; 7 August 2008, 10:38 AM.
                  Sean

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Critique my upflow design

                    Sean, I use the Bunnings bags and then settling for a number of reasons

                    1) I do not clean the bunnings bags out, i use once and throw away ($1 cost for about 200 litres of oil is good value to me)

                    2) I do not have to mess around with the slow draining of all the fats at the bottom of the barrel

                    3) I regularaly drain off about 20 litres from the bottom of my upflow settling tank that gets used in my burner, so i prefer this to be cleaner (relatively)

                    4) From the upflow it gravity feeds through 5 micron bags and then gravity feeds through 1 micron bags.

                    5) Finally runs down into a 1000litre IBC for settling and mist washing (about 200 litres of washing for every 800 litres of oil) (We have 20,000 litres of water tanks so water waste is not an issue.

                    When i am in full swing with two cars, diesel gen and oil burner going we will be using 300litres week in WInter, so in the process of stockpiling now

                    C
                    Holden Suburban K2500 1998 6.5L Turbo GM engine
                    210,000KMs (90,000 on new crate motor)

                    Currently 2 tanks in and working - 90 litre BIO tank and main tank of 160L WVO

                    30 plate FPHE in Engine bay and Helton Dual coil in rear
                    Walbro FRB-5 pusher pumps x 2

                    50,000KM on Veg and 10,000Km on B100

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Critique my upflow design

                      I use about 8 green bags in an old oil heater tank cut in half (and plumbed together). Even clogged with fats the filters seem to pass a lot of oil, just slowly. I change one or 2 bags at a time, pour the cleaner oil through them, and the fats I pour into the older bags to slowly filter through.
                      cheers<BR>Chris.<BR>1990 landcruiser 80, 1HD-T two tank, copper pipe HE+ 20 plate FPHE, toyota solenoids and filters. 1978 300D, elsbett one tank system.<BR>

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Critique my upflow design

                        I've been bored at work recently so I updated my diagram,taking into account some of the suggestions people have made and some ideas of my own:
                        Sean

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Critique my upflow design

                          Fantastic!
                          Can you qoute on building one for me?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Critique my upflow design

                            baffleplate should be higher up.

                            those drill pumps are deadset the best ever BUT only those orange ones ( all others are too slow)
                            I have two of them to move bio and wvo around the place.
                            I know oily has pumped over 3000 litres of bio with his one and its still goin strong.
                            They might be too quick for your needs though. (remember centrifugal pumps slow on oil BUT positive displacement types don't) Mine does over 40 litres a minute on cold WVO.
                            i would go for a bilge pump or the caravan type 10-17 litres/min type with a good check valve.

                            I also think your top vent valve is un nessary.

                            Goodluck sean

                            PS: Go see David then you will know what your new setup will look like

                            Cheers Nick.
                            Cheers
                            Nick.
                            Harold 2002 Toyota Landcruiser 105 series. 4.2lt turbo glide turbo, Too lazy to make bio nowdays times money. 3'' lift.

                            Roidio 2001 Holden Rodeo 4x4 2.8L TD. 2.5" exhaust sytem, H/E shower system. 4" Lift, Airbags, And lots of fruit, B100 for 55,000 . SOLD

                            Elsa 1983 Mercedes-Benz W123 300D. Still The Fastest Merc in Oz, Self built and Female proofed. COUSINS NOW
                            sigpic

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Critique my upflow design

                              Looks good however it is missing 2 features which make my upflow system work well. 1. Cone bottom vessels with drain cocks at the bottom. (gets all the water right to the bottom and makes it a cinch to drain it out).
                              2. Ability to add oil very slowly by gravity, I'm talking 4hrs for 20 litres. (This means the settled oil is not stirred up as it moves through the 4 drums).
                              Johnnojack
                              4WD Isuzu Jackaroo 3.1 200000km on WVO,(2020) 2 tank home built system 6 solenoids FPHE, heated filter fuel line and tank pickup for thicker oil. Mk. 9 version now and no changes planned as trouble free.
                              Mercedes W201 190D 1986 model: 2 tank system, bigger fuel line from tank, no heat exchanger, electric pump for diesel 22000km so far sigpic

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