The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

[isuzurover Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close isuzurover]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

As I understand it, this device claims to operate on the principle of catalytic cracking. I have some experience in industrial catalytic cracking processes, and to my knowledge almost no industrial catalytic cracking processes use magnets to aid the cracking, or use zinc/tin catalyst. Zeolite is the most common catalyst used. Furthermore, industrial devices (e.g. in a refinery) usually operate at high temperatures and pressures.

For these reasons I am sceptical of devices such as this.

I would like to propose a slightly different (and easier) test to determine if the device actually works as claimed. That would be to pass fuel (biodiesel/diesel/petrol) through the device, at a temperature, pressure and flow rate specified by the manufacturer, and analyse samples of the fuel before and after (by HPLC or similar) to determine the molecular composition of the fuel. Thus if the device works as claims, and catalytically cracks some of the molecules passing through it, this difference (however small) can be observed by these tests. After the device has been shown to work as claimed, then actual vehicle tests could be performed.

The chemistry department of UNSW should easily be able to analyse the fuel samples before and after catalytic treatment.

[Terry Syd Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Terry Syd]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

Heck, maybe we could get Robert to volunteer his "Viscometer" (it really should work).

[Robert Administrator Find all posts View Profile Close Robert]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

I'd have to put it inside a cardboard box first with my multimeter - and that does not work so well for photos.

[isuzurover Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close isuzurover]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

Heck, maybe we could get Robert to volunteer his "Viscometer" (it really should work).

I doubt a viscometer would be sensitive enough to measure any small changes, you would need something that can provide molecular/compositional information, like High Performance Liquid Chromatography.

[Spiritman Biofuels Forum Newbie Find all posts View Profile Close Spiritman]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

OK, I a noob here, But I have had two bad winters with the short storage time of gas now. Two years in a row I used different products to stabilize the gas in my 1997 Ninja1100. Both times I had a mess in the spring. I had to replace the jets and clean out the carbs. And that gas smelled really bad!! Then last year I got the Fitch product. After last years winter. With nothing in my tank but the Fitch and gas. This spring I was sold!! It stared right up. And ran great! Like I just filled it up with High Octane!! I don't work for Fitch. They are not paying me.
I just know that
THIS STUFF WORKS.

[Terry Syd Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Terry Syd]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

I hope this catalyst is for real. I would also like to see a test. Perhaps a dual fuel line to an engine on a dyno. One line with the catalyst and one without, the engine would be running at the same temperature, barometric pressure and with the same source of fuel for each test. All you would have to do is just switch the valve from one line to the other.

If there really is a 5-10% (35%??) difference, the dyno should pick it up immediately. Then you can switch back for corroboration, then switch again -easy!

Having tuned heaps of engines, when I see a claim for 10% increase, I am rather dubious, but then again I was intially dubious about making fuel from waste vegetable oil.

I support Browser Buster, let's see some emperical testing using objective testing equipment.

[Cameron Moderator Find all posts View Profile Close Cameron]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

I am massively dubious about that previous post Terry.

Why is someone who claims to ride a petrol powered motorbike coming onto a forum for biodiesel and in his first post ever giving us some bullshit rave?

Regardless of whether Fitch works or not I reckon that post is bogus.

Cameron

[Dodge Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Dodge]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

why would you replace the jets bad fuel does not have any effect on the jets apart from blocking them, they wont have changed diameter or be scatched from bad fuel, you have obviously got water in your fuel tank.
30 years riding motorbikes i have never had jets become damaged by fuel.
The damage i have had was caused by me using the wrong tools for job.

[Terry Syd Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Terry Syd]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

Dodge, I used to store my dirt bike for 6 months or more. Yes, the fuel would go off if left in the tank, but it wouldn't clog up anything let alone damage something. What I eventually did was just drain the tank (the lawnmower always need fuel) when I stored it.

If this guy had a significant problem the first year, he would probably do something about it for the second year.

I fail to see how a catalyst could prevent the lighter distillates from evaporating off. How could it do that? Plug up the air vent perhaps?

"This stuff works" - ok, prove it. The above test I proposed takes the variables out of the testing. Dyno figures are constantly fiddled with in various reports. A 'flash' reading on one day, versus a steady state hot running are like comparing apples to oranges. Some times the ambient temperature and barometric pressure are fiddled with. Do it on a day of increased barometric pressure and it is a subtle way of 'supercharging' the engine on the dyno.

The catalyst is supposed to modify the fuel. The two fuel line test will prove/disprove that almost instantly and provide convincing corroboration by being able to shfit back and forth between the two fuel lines.

[tillyfromparadise Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close tillyfromparadise]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

Oh you people of little faith.
It is all explained quite clearly on the Fitch Australian website
http://www.fitchcatalyst.com.au/FAQs.asp

"Q. How does the catalyst work?
A. All hydrocarbon fuels contain gums and resins which cause the fuel molecules of petrol and Diesel fuel to conglomerate in clusters. These clusters are too large to bum completely in the extremely short time that the burning fuel is in the combustion chamber. Therefore, these unburned molecules enter the exhaust stream as a smoky gas and do not contribute any power to the operation of the engine. The Catalyst dissolves these gums and resins so that these clusters of molecules do not form, allowing all the fuel to be used for power."

It is all about gums and resing being disolved.
Anyone who has even the slightest knowledge of Petrol fuels knows that conglomerating clusters caused by gums and resins are one of the most sinister problems facing internal combustion engines today.

If you could possibly have any further doubts, these pictures from the Fitch US Website will clear them up in an instant!







I am sure everyone will agree this is the absolute positive proof everyone needs.

Tilly

[Spiritman Biofuels Forum Newbie Find all posts View Profile Close Spiritman]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

Wow, is this the way that you guys treat your members? I feel like I was called a lier! Did you ever think that it was just easier to replace the jet's than try to clean them? I stopped by here to tell you a true story. Ether prove me a lier or not. But lets be adults here!! OK? I did replace the jets. If you believe me or not.

[Robert Administrator Find all posts View Profile Close Robert]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

1. This is an Australian Forum (We refer to petroleum fuel as "petrol", petroleum distillate as "diesel" and "gas" as LPG, or you may know it as propane, so when you refer to "gas" in a motor bike, you will rightly confuse most people here).
2. We talk about biodiesel.
3. This thread is for discussing the Fitch Catalyst, specifically in relation to biodiesel.

Spirtman, sorry if you feel that other users have not given you a fair hearing. Terry was not asking you to prove whether you changed your jets or not, he was seeking proof about Fitch's claims. No one is calling you a liar. We are simply seeking some real, reproducable, scientifically credible evidence that this Fitch Catalyst device would be effective on biodiesel. Thanks for your anecdotal experiences.

If anyone can find any real information on this product, such as those that Terry has recently proposed, then please post it here.

[adamjedgar Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close adamjedgar]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

Hi guys,
im am new here and i hope that doesnt make my comments seem innapropriate. I am a former design and technology teacher and whilst the chemistry behind this idea is not my area of expertise i have a much more "bush mechanic" query for you all. Is the cost of this bloody thing going to offset the finacial benefits of using it? Some of the other "fuel saving" (for example) systems i have come across, cost such an excessive amount of money, and require regular additional costs (eg replacement after a given period of time), that the idea of even bothering to us em for savings is truly....pointless!!!

[Guest Close leongster]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

I am new to this forum, but have posted some feedback on the Fitch catalyst on the nissan forum site ( the x-trail threads), under the same user name: Leongster (after my dog, Leong, who is a monster, if you have to ask).

For the record, I am not in any way associated with Fitch apart from the fact that I have been communicating with the local principal to obtain more technical data (not much luck there, as the exact composition of the catalyst is patent-protected).

I have spent the past two months undertaking much research on fuel catalysts, including Broquet and Fuelcat, and the Fitch catalyst intrigued me most. So I purchased a small quantity of this for tests on my own vehicles. Initial results on an old lawnmower left me in disbelief, so I investigated further. Don't ask how, but I eventually managed to arrange for a larger model Fitch to be tested on a 12,000cc 500bhp fire-engine weighing around 28,000kgs. This vehicle is used for active service. and runs on a Detroit diesel straight six with turbocharger. My thinking was, if this thing was pure hype, then maybe the Fitch guys would chicken out of a high-profile test that could potentially ruin them.

In a nutshell:

The 0-80 kph test times without treated fuel: 36.6 seconds (average of 3 2-way runs)

The 0-80 kph test times with Fitch treated fuel: 33.4 seconds (average of 4 2-way runs)

All figures independantly clocked by the vehicle crew, with about a half dozen witnesses.

I do not know how much additional horsepower or torque is needed to produce that sort of improvement in acceleration in a vehicle weighing close to 28 tonnes. But I have to say that I was a little surprised by the results, as were most of the people involved in the test. The crew even did a 4th run without any prompting as they too were quite intrigued...

Treatment consisted of immersing the Fitch F10 (10 pellets) in a 200 litre tank of freshly pumped diesel for 48 hours to "catalyse" the diesel. Thereafter transferring it to the test vehicle immediately after the baseline test. We had to top this off with another 50 litres of untreated diesel in order to bring the vehicle up to operating specs.

I'm a photographer, and so I ended up documenting the whole event and intend to post a report on the Nissan forum as soon as I have put one together, but ONLY if I can summon up the guts when the time comes, as I have drawn a lot of flak for my views which have been nothing but controversial.

I believe I have a better understanding of how the Fitch works, as a result of several discussions that I have had with chemical engineers and a metallurgist, and I have some theories. But I am not a technologist and so I'd better not go there.

All the same I'd really like to do an analysis of the catalyst's make-up but have been told this is near impossible, given that the materials appear to have been sintered.

Any scientists out there willing to take this thing apart?

What we really need is for more people to come forward with their personal experience with the Fitch (not to simply quote wholesale the websites' contents). Brickbats and bouquets are welcome - but give the Facts Please!

It remains for us as thinking individuals to separate the hype from the facts for ourselves then.

[Darren Biofuels Forum Newbie Find all posts View Profile Close Darren]

Re: The Fitch Catalyst - Genuine Improvement or Fake Hype?

Would be very interested to see the pictures please post the link when your done.

I still reckon this is snake oil, who in there right mind would risk doing anything to an operational fire engine?

The fitch website has no concrete proof of anything on it and the link to http://www.fuelsaving.info/catalysts.htm just about says it all in my mind.

Anyhow if this device did react with the hydrocarbon based fuel in some way it would have no effect of the FME's of biodiesel.

The temptation is to buy one and have it spectrum analyzed but then your still buying the product. SNAKE OIL untill I see some results from a BP or Shell lab or a live before and after dyno run.